Friday, December 18, 2009

They Don't Like It Up 'Em

There's been a vicious reaction on the Left to my post earlier urging people to support Adeela Shafi in her bid to oust Labour MP Kerry McCarthy. I mean, Conservative blogger wants Labour MP to lose is hardly a surprise, is it? But to lefties on Twitter you'd have thought I had urged the killing of the first born. It's brought out all the usual suspects who have been venting their spleens to their, literally, dozens of followers.

Apparently this is the first sign of the Conservatives playing dirty. I ask you. According to some, I am coordinating a campaign at the behest, of well, who knows. The simple truth is that it was my idea and I posted it and sat back and watched to see what would happen. Well, so far people have donated in excess of £300 to Adeela's campaign. Good. I hope there will be more to come.

Anyone who reads this blog regularly knows that there are plenty of Labour and LibDem politicians I rate, and who I have, on occasion, praised. But I am a Conservative. I want the Conservatives to win. And like anyone else, there are some Labour MPs who I would dearly like to see the back of more than others. And I see absolutely nothing wrong in saying so. The worst thing I have said about Kerry is that I don't think she is fit to be an MP. The same people who seem aghast at me calling for Kerry McCarthy to lose are the very same ones who think nothing of saying the most vicious, hurtful things about Nadine Dorries, to say nothing of the bile they pour out against me.

They're hypocrites. The lot of them. And they're going to lose.

UPDATE: The latest bizarre conspiracy theory on Twitter, courtesy of the deluded BevaniteEllie, is that this was all concocted at a bloggers lunch at CCHQ on Tuesday ... which I wasn't even at. And if you want a laugh read this ridiculous excuse for an Exclusive, which James Macintyre has posted on the new Staggers blog. I've spoken to three people who were at the lunch and they say he's got virtually every fact, assertion mor insinuation wrong - as Sam Coates points out in the comments...

I've made sure I've got a copy of this post - it takes some going to write a few hundred words without wandering near any actual truth! Not a single thing you say was said at the lunch was actually said - ask anyone who was actually there. Saying Eric Pickles was there is wrong. The number of attendees is wildly wrong. Even the pudding is wrong!In fact, the only things that are right are a few basic snippets that were posted online by centre-right blogs on the day: 1) that it happened on Tuesday, 2) that Hunt, Macrory and the new media team were there, and 3) that there was some boar in the main course). Cracking journalism.



UPDATE: Shane Greer has fisked Mr Macintyre.

UPDATE 7.10: These internet things can spread quickly it seems. Someone just emailed me about this new website KERRYOUT! Nothing to do with me, guv. UPDATE: looks like a Tory Bear initiative.

29 comments:

no longer anonymous said...

They're probably annoyed because the Tory candidate is an Asian female.

DM Andy said...

I notice that you haven't actually posted links or quoted any of the "vicious" response. Care to enlighten me?

Clive said...

Well Iain, that's being a bit "economical with the truth". The reason many take Nadine to task is for a number of reasons, supported with evidence. For example, her attack on Ben Goldacre; the "evidence" she used during the abortion debate; her website funding shenanigans; her "suicide watch" pronouncements regarding MP's expenses; etc. There really is a long list.

The purely personal and spiteful attacks are unnecessary. And that applies to all Parties and their supporters. "Two wrongs don't make a right" may be overused, but it still holds true. And so a "They do to Nadine so that makes it okay" is a pretty fatuous argument.

john in cheshire said...

In my opinion, socialists are liars. that's what they do. they've got it down to an art form; after all, they've had 100 years to perfect it. The problem is that they don't even know they are lying, they lie so often and for so many reasons. And when they see someone who actually tells the truth, it must hurt their small, genetically defective brains. That's why they bleat so much about everything they see as abnormal. I don't think there is any purpose engaging in discussion with lying socialists. the best thing would be to cull them from the country.

Iain Dale said...

Clive, I have never said or written anything personally offensive about Kerry. Few of your friends could say the same about Nadine, sadly. Just look at posts which mention her on LibCon. They are disgraceful. By all means criticise her for her views but the name calling is terrible.

Iain Dale said...

DM Andy, follow the twitter hashtag.

The Raven said...

Great stuff, Iain. They really do seem to think they have an automatic right to be elected and govern, and that it's something of an affront to even challenge that notion.

Clive said...

But Iain, wouldn't you consider "Not fit to be an MP" to be personally offensive when you fail to provide any justification. Especially in light of your recent public spat?

Or perhaps "I've always thought Labour's self styled Twitter Tsar Kerry McCarthy MP was one vote short of a ballot box"

And why are the people at LibCon my friends. Is that an attempt to undermine reasoned discussion using "guilt by association"? Because you don't have a clue who my friends are. Oh you'll probably reference Tim and Justin, but that friendship goes back nearly a decade. And I visit LibCon maybe once a week if that, so don't try and tar me with that brush.

Perhaps I should counter with "your friends" at Order-Order, or your "buddy" Tory Bear? Compared to some of the malodorous utterance made on that blog, the comments about Nadine are positively tame. But that would be resorting to the argument that "they do it so it's okay for us to use the same tactics"; a stance both sides are guilty of.

This is where social networking falls flat on its face. As a means of communication it gives all the appearance of being quicker than thought in 99.9% of cases. With all the associated consequences.

Add in the natural tendency of too many people to refuse to admit error and thus defend the indefensible at all costs, and you have the cesspit that holds a significant proportion of the political blogging arena these day.

Throw in the popularity of Paul Staines's blog with its rank and fetid comment threads and is it any wonder that instead of reasoned debate we get offensive and ad-hominen attacks? Bloggers such as Tory Bear are an inevitable consequence and do nothing to further debate.

It all could have been so different, but too late now. Anyone who wants to be a public political figure is just going to have to put up with online s**tstorms, because some bloggers put popularity before responsible conduct.

C'est la guerre...

... more's the pity.

DM Andy said...

Okay Iain, I've just done what you suggest and searched for #kerryout

From the right side, Kerry is called a moron, expenses fraudster, smearer, a b*stard.

From the left side your campaign is called pathetic, idiotic and negative. Not you, the #kerryout campaign.

Pathetic, idiotic and negative doesn't sound too vicious to me especially compared to what your supporters are saying. I would be disappointed if your blog stopped being a good read and became about name-calling.

Clive said...

no longer anonymous said...

"They're probably annoyed because the Tory candidate is an Asian female."

I think that is more a reflection on yourself than those you accuse.

trevorsden said...

As I keep saying - you are far too forgiving of your political opponents.

Lefties are a bunch of tossers - and yes they do not like it up 'em.

Oh and on another thing - The reason Brown came out of that cupboard? When he got there he found it was bare'

oh and another another thing - bugger off Clive - you big soft lardy (to use a global warming phrase) asshole.
Methinks you do protest too much.

Clive said...

trevorsden, I rest my case. You are the perfect illustration of a) Iain's willingness to tolerate abusive and pointless comments and b) the inarticulate and infantile nature of so many on the right.

Vos es a nequam quod vacuus misellus creatura

Paul Halsall said...

Umm.

I think you are taking Twitter too seriously Iain.

Elections are not really determined, at least in UK (and probably not in the US last year) by what goes on in the inter tubes.

The economy, whether Brown has made a mess of it or not; whether Cameron will work mainly for his own social class, or not; and how pissed off everyone is with a 13 year old government are the issues.

My guess is 13 years of government will be decisive and count for the Tories. Since I don't really like many government ministers I would not be that disappointed to see a hung parliament.

Meanwhile, get over yourself grrl!

Paul Halsall said...

@trevorsden

All men are tossers.

And for those who can't the NHS will prescribe Viagra.

norfolkandchance said...

Calling Kerry unfit to be an MP on the same day as you praise Mr and Mrs Dodgy-Expenses does suggest strange values. As for Twitter, the leader of your own party made the best comment about what too many twits make. 140 characters doesn't exactly allow rational debate.

no longer anonymous said...

"I think that is more a reflection on yourself than those you accuse."

What the Hell are you on about? I was making the point that lefties like to charge the Tories with sexism and racism. However, they can't attack Kerry's opponent with these smears which is no doubt frustrating for them.

Matthew said...

The Kerry Twitter row and now Macintyre's article show that the Left just does not get blogging, and has a long way to go. If I may advertise my more lengthy post on this...

http://prologue.squarespace.com/prologue/2009/12/18/why-the-right-continues-to-dominate-the-blogosphere.html

Gareth said...

"Apparently this is the first sign of the Conservatives playing dirty. I ask you. According to some, I am coordinating a campaign at the behest, of well, who knows."

Maggie Fatcher.

That's who the left usually blames.

Unsworth said...

@ DM Andy

"From the right side, Kerry is called a moron, expenses fraudster, smearer, a b*stard."

'Right'? How do you know? You think it inconceivable that the Left (or anyone on the Left) might have these opinions of Ms McCarthy?

However, it's patent that she is a moron, an expenses fraudster, and a smearer. As to a 'b*stard', well it depends on what you mean by 'b*stard', doesn't it?

John said...

Iain

You posted:

"And they're going to lose"

May I suggest that you send an email to all your contacts within the Tory party and tell them to play the "we are not confident of victory, we have a huge mountain to climb, we are not complacent. In fact we would be amazed if we formed the next Government."

I want the Conservatives to win next time. I've voted for all 3 main parties during my life.

However, a few people I know are annoyed by this assumption that the Tories are going to win.

YOU ARE NOT.

Stop coming out with sloppy remarks. There are important things at stake here.

In 1997, when everyone in the country knew that Tony Blair was going to storm the election, he always said that he wasn't confident of victory. He won by a landslide. If you win, you are certainly NOT going to win by a landslide.

Some of you conservatives are sounding complacent.

If you keep on like this I think you will be bitten in the arse and we will have Labour for another 5 years - horror!!!

DM Andy said...

@unsworth

One of them came from a certain @ToryBear, I didn't think he's a leftie, but I guess you must be right.

Martin Wellbourne said...

All this "We've as good as won" stuff IS a bit previous, is it not?

Labour are, after all, the party of "Free money for doing f*** all". That's a winning policy for a lot of people who, in simpler times, would have eaten all the tiny weeny little plants as soon as they came poking their heads up out of the ground and would have then starved.

Never underestimate the stupidity of an awful lot of people.

Osama the Nazarene said...

Of course you have every right to campaign against anyone in the Nuliebor you've identified as being unfit to be an MP. Why the surprise among the liebor twiterati.

As for Mcintyre he is just following in the footsteps of the liebor spin machine. Mixing pseudo facts with outright lies. Dr Goebbels would be pleased.

Richard said...

Thought I'd be the first person to point out that the Conservative candidate actually finished a well-beaten third in Bristol East in 2005. The result was:

Lab 19152
LD 10531
C 8787
Grn 1586
UKIP 1132
Respect 532
(Lab majority 8621)

(FYI - The Conservatives had finished second in 2001)

On that basis, if the campaign is really about an "independent" effort to get "Kerry out" surely the best placed party to do just that is the Liberal Democrats?

Of course, this is a Conservative-supporting site and of course Iain Dale wants to support the Conservative candidate, but won't a split opposition vote just lead to an easy Labour victory?

Iain Dale said...

Richard, there are boundary changes. Rallings & Thrasher say 2005 wouldhave been ...

Labour: 20047 (44.8%)
Conservative: 12668 (28.3%)
Liberal Democrat: 9139 (20.4%)
Other: 2926 (6.5%)
Majority: 7379 (16.5%)

Stephen said...

To be honest though I've heard the most vituperative stuff about Nadine from people on our own side and I personally find her attention-seeking diva act incredibly difficult to defend. She's the Heather Mills of politics.

Not that I'm trying to defend Kerry the Twitter here because I barely know who she is and I'm confident she's going to lose anyway.

Angelin77 said...

The publication of MPs Expenses has given us a unique opportunity to judge the integrity of our MPs.I don't need be offensive towards Nadine. I, like many of her constituents, may not understand the workings of Parliament but we do understand household budgets.When it comes to the Election,I will ponder the fact that she maxed up on her allowance to rent a large family property (and all the associated higher utility costs) instead of a more reasonable one suitable for a single person making part time use of what is supposed to be a 'second' home. I will ponder the fact that she has, through many media channels,stated that she never made claims for cleaners nor food Not that she could have done so when there was little left in her kitty after paying the rent/council tax.But there certainly are several 400 pound food claims and cleaning claims when the funds were there. And I will ponder how a single person supposedly living part time in a property could rack up a 1000 pound a quarter gas bill, maybe only when the public are picking up the tab, at a time when politicians are lecturing on the need to reduce our use of fossil fuels.
Iain you may decide not to publish this comment. But come the General Election Nadine's political opponents will be making great capital out of Nadine's expenses, as will happen, I'm sure, to all the present elected members.

Ray said...

I recently commented on a Lib Dem site that if they really wanted to show some Political nounce, they would think the whole thing through ahead of the next election. They cannot win, but, if they threw their weight behind the conservatives, and forced the death of Liebour, they would be the official opposition, at the moment and for the forseeable future if they continue to be so naive they will never make opposition let alone in an election.

Matthew Dear said...

When will they finally accept that whilst they, with their centralising way, try to pulls the strings (c.f. Drapergate and LabourList) most Tory bloggers are genuinely independent, and independent-minded?

If they chose to read your blog a little more deeply they'd realise straight away that you're no lackey. And, dare I say it, for an even better example they should try Tim Montgomerie!

Sometime I cringe at the possible effects of his editorials and exclusives, but I'll be darnded if he doesn't say precisely what he (HE) thinks about things.