I could hardly believe my ears this morning, listening to my old mucker Yasmin Alibhai-Brown on 5 Live, talking about the US election. Shelagh Fogarty quoted a poll saying that 97% of black voters in America are supporting Obama. She asked Yasmin if she thought it was OK for black people to vote for him purely because he is black. Yasmin said yes, she thought it was absolutely fine.
I wonder what she would have said to white voters voting for McCain purely on the basis that he is white. Sadly that question wasn't asked.
And I say this as an Obama supporter.
39 comments:
I read something earleir today on Finkelstein's blog about Labour party members going over to help get out voters, but calling only on houses in the black neighbourhoods. As you suggest, the idea of David Cameron sending a posse over to the Hamptons to raise McCain would be roundly condemned.
The BBC informed us this morning that one black voter they were interviewing could remember when "black voters had the dogs set on them when they turned out to vote"
I can remember a time when the BBC reported the facts not urban myths.
Iain, are you seriously saying you cannot see the difference?
Equality in a state of injustice merely deepens and sustains that injustice. Unequal treatment is potentially justifiable where it seeks to rectify injustice. Simple as that.
Surely you weren't surprised by the unlovely Yasmin's spoutings?
Another question is "would he have won the nomination or even come close to winning the presidency if he was white?"
But Obama is half Black and half White.
ie a Half Cast
Surely nobody is surprised at the racist element in this campaign, and how only white racism is condemned but blask racism is accepted.
Obama is benefitting from this. A colleague of mine, a black New Yorker, has been saying for months that many PC whites are voting for Obama so that they can say they are not 'racist'.
There are reasons to support Obama, although I don't.
But we are still a long way from Martin Luther King's dream where people are judged by the content of their character rather than by the colour of their skin.
Yasmin being a racist leftie? Gee what a shock. Surely this is par for the course from her.
Anonymous said...
Iain, are you seriously saying you cannot see the difference?
Equality in a state of injustice merely deepens and sustains that injustice. Unequal treatment is potentially justifiable where it seeks to rectify injustice. Simple as that.
November 04, 2008 6:09 PM
What a load of bollocks!
Black people in America always vote Democrat, the high percentages for Obama are not unusual. A quick google shows Gore got 95% and Kerry 93%.
I suppose the split in the primary vote might be more interesting.
And of course its not just blacks who support Obama because he is black. Boris Johnson and Dan Hannan, to mention just two Tories, talk improving race relations when they come out for Obama. They mean, in not so many words, it iz 'e is black.
Er to be fair have white people been waiting many years for a white candidate to stand?
anon @6.09.
You are right. Talk of 'black racism' is crass and reveals the racist heart that beats beneath the breast of most Tories, however 'progressive' they may claim to be. Yes, even you, Iain.
Why are you surprised, Iain? Anyone who didn't think YAB was a racist would have had their doubts dispelled by that rant she puked shortly after Boris won in London.
Anon 6.09 - how very convenient to be able to use that pathetic reasoning whenever suited. The reverse, ofcourse, would be illegal. Idiot.
"Equality in a state of injustice merely deepens and sustains that injustice. Unequal treatment is potentially justifiable where it seeks to rectify injustice. Simple as that."
And unequal treatment is really going to make the majority more tolerant and understanding isn't it?
Idiots like you make the BNP cream themselves.
Captain Skint
Why so touchy? Is it becoz you is racist? Just askin...
Anon @ 6.09 is allegedly talking 'convenient' idiotic 'bollocks'. He's got a point though. As my anonymous friend @6.34 put it, white people haven't exactly been waiting for white representation, have they.
Arkangel,
Why is it bollocks? If you treat everyone the same, any existing inequalities will persist.
I think it's 'bollocks' that people are so resentful of a black man potentially becoming President.
Captain Skint
Yes, and why exactly is the reverse illegal? Because that's what's been happening for decades to black people and it's led to massive injustice. Positive action in their favour merely makes a start on correcting historical wrongs. That's the difference, you racist half-wit.
You raise an interesting point, Iain. But my response to the survey is to ask why 97% of blacks think like this. The answer to that question tells us why this is not about 'black racism' at all. Quite the reverse.
Napoleon stated, "I hope the time is not far off when I shall be able to unite all the wise and educated men of all the countries and establish a uniform
regime based on the principles of Qur'an which alone are true and which alone can lead men to happiness."
http://www.balaams-ass.com/alhaj/islal2.htm
Remember that Napoleon was the architect of the United States of Europe.
Hitler also tried to unify Europe and was a great admirer of Islam, "The Mohammedan religion too would have been much more compatible to us than
Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness….”5 (A. Speer, Inside the Third Reich, pp. 142-143) "
http://infowars.com/infowars.asx
Europe is to become Islamic.
http://bfbwwiii.blogspot.com/2007/10/frankfurt-subversion.html
Treachery
http://uppompeii1.uppompeii.com/2008/11/01/strategy-for-capacity-building-of-mosques--islamic-organizations--mcb.aspx
Iain, this is a touch disappointing. The difference, as some above have pointed out, is totally bleeding obvious. It is because historically black people have suffered every conceivable oppression from outright slavery to routine discrimination. It is simply terrific that we are to have a black President, just as it was great to have a woman Prime Minister in 1979. The difference is that somehow I can't see Obama losing all sense of reality and ending up stabbed in the back by his own side . . .
its cos black people, or mixed race people, or those in relationships with somebody of a different colour, or those with mixed race kids - can see the world differently - after all my mixed race relationship with my asian partner would have been illegal in over a dozen US States in our lifetime. Of course many black people and others will vote on racial grounds. I hope that in a very few years, after Barack has been President, people will ONLY vote for him cos of his policies - in the meantime people will use this as an opportunity to express their belief that a Black man can be President of the USA. We are all children of history and if your own history, including your recent lifetime history, includes segregation and racism, it is inevitable that many black people will vote this way today.
An "Obama supporter", eh? You were just about the last person in Western Europe to endorse him. Late. To. The. Party. You do not qualify as a supporter.
Only in recent times Blacks are voting for Democrats. Since its founding in 1850s, the GOP was an anti-slavery party and Martin Luther King was a Republican. Americans are
easy about the voting patterns based on ethnic and linguitic lines inventing the word 'caucuses'-Italian Caucus, Asian Caucus etc..
As some one who is 'brown in colour', I never believed in 'colour politics', 'affirmative action' in USA, faith schools and social engineering and victimisation nonsense here and hates Yasmin Alibhai's colour-tainted political commentaries. Just why any one talks to her is something I never understood. I also resent the one-sided appreciation of Mandela without giving due credit to de Klerk for his brave decisions.
Obama himself was asked to comment on the fact that a lot of people might vote for him because he was black. He replied that no doubt many people would definitely not vote for him because he was black too. So it would all even out. That was a great answer.
Why is it racist to be against positive discrimination? Why should someone be promoted when they're less qualified, able and commited?
I can certainly understand movements to actively promote the civil service, judiciary, police etc to certain demographics. But consider if surgeons were positively discriminated or fighter pilots or the higher ranks of any organisation.
I don't think Obama has in any way used his race as an issue because he's talented, qualified and has inspired people.
My complaint was the myopic inverted racism used by YAB and the blatant hypocrisy that some random criteria can be applied by the loonies when they claim political discrimination when in actual fact it's just bloody racism on their terms. I'm all for being racially aware and would happily add financial incentives to JOIN organisations which are ethnically unrepresentative - but after that, it's the same game for everyone. If procedures aren't in place to prevent discrimination then fight them - it's incremental but getting better. But the blatant retort when I complain of auteurs taking liberties in that i'm racist is up to you. I'm not - but I don't want unqualified people in my squadron.
That's what I was complaining about. The bullshit. If you don't want the best doctor for your kid then you're lying. Simple as that.
YAB is Nick Griffin - extremist and offensive shite.
McCain will win.
Race? Aaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrgggghhhhhhhhh!
Always race, race, race, race. And it'll get worse with Obama in. We'll be talking about it even more than now.
Won't it ever stop?
Answer: no.
"Yes, and why exactly is the reverse illegal? Because that's what's been happening for decades to black people and it's led to massive injustice. Positive action in their favour merely makes a start on correcting historical wrongs. That's the difference, you racist half-wit."
So those opposed to "positive discrimination" are racist are they? Well that's probably the vast majority of British people. You do realise clowns like you increase support for the BNP don't you?
I don't suppose it occurs to you that many of us are opposed to the governmednt promoting positive or negative discrimination on the basis that we want the government to sod off and get off our backs? What is it with the Left and their irresistable urge to meddle and interfere?
"It is because historically black people have suffered every conceivable oppression from outright slavery to routine discrimination."
And so voting on a racial basis is a step forward? This simply reinforces ethnic divisions. If America was really on the path to racial harmony nobody would give a sod what colour the candidates were. For blacks to vote as a racial bloc is hardly conducive to the growth of a colour blind society.
As the saying goes Lipstick on a PIG means it is still a PIG
Yasmin
Nest time you see Yasmin Iain can you ask her when she thinks the next blonde haired blue eyed caucasion will be elected in:
Pakistan
India
China
Indonesia
Malaysia
Yemen?
I can answer on her behalf if you like that would erm --- never.
Racist give us a break and get your own houses in order before you ever lecture others Yas babay
I don't normally involve myself in race issues because... well its usually over blown, heated and rarely reflects what's happening in reality.
Anyway, just watching Fox News a few moments ago and Karl Rove (yes that one) roundly shot down the notion that race played any part in this election. He said that rather than viewing Obama as America's first black family, we should remember America had a national black family in the 60's with the much loved Bill Crosby. He pointed out that we (meaning Americans) watch Sports and TV commercials featuring people from other races without pointing to the screen and saying 'look, a black person'. He makes the same points about our work places and contrasts that with 40 years ago when in much of the US work place a black face might be a rare sight for many. He finishes by saying that race just isn't the issue that it used to be. I'd tend to agree.
Senator McCain is currently on screen giving his consession speech and he opens on a note of pride that America has its first African-American President. A theme he touches on a couple of times. Good for him.
While politically I didn't want an Obama win, I am pleased America has elected a black President. This will do much to sweep away and perhaps draw a line under so much of America's guilt about the not so distant past. Yes there's still a way to go but it took a huge huge step forward tonight.
Now, if three middle-aged white guys can think like this (Myself, McCain and Rove) I hope those who wish to see injustice around every corner take similar pause.
Ugh you positive discrimination apologists make me want to puke. When my family came to the US from Italy in the early 20th century they were villified, suffered all kinds of discrimination, called wops, guineas, grease balls and worse. Till this day all Italians are tarred with the Mafia brush - so where were the positive discrimination laws for them? My family just put their heads down, worked hard and perservered and from being a penniless stowaway my grandfather ended up owning several restaurants and prime property in New York.
I will put it to you this way - anybody who voted for Obama BECAUSE he is black (and that means you, Oprah Winfrey) is racist.
It will be interesting to see if all those black racists who howled that whites are racists who won't elect a black guy are now going to apologise in public for being hateful bigots... (queue the chirping crickets...)
People like Tracy Chapman come to mind, who also overtly used her racist musings to sell records on her tour, ironically, to European whites, posing as a liberal.
Yes but you're also a sanctimonious twat completely out of touch with the electorate. When will this finally sink in?
Nothing much else has worked for black americans since Reconstruction, so why shouldn't a vote for the first black president be as valid a political reason as any other?
Unspoken but implicit within the question was the phrase 'democrat or republican'.
Neither party has offered much to black americans, and what has been offered has often been clawed back in some states.
Demolishing the race barrier can be seen by many Afro-americans as being just as important as tinkering with the economy. Historically, they are used to being betrayed by business and politics. But this is one achievement which simply cannot be denied. 'They can't take that away from me' as the old song says.
I am not surprised that many black people are racist, but in the good anti white sort of way. I was amused when Jessie Jackson ranted against Obama because he thought Obama was not black enough! How his crocodile tears flowed on the night Obama won. But in the UK we have many urban areas where voters always vote labour no matter who the person is or his/her views. They could put a stuffed teddy bear with a red rosette up for election and it would get in as a Labour MP.
You shouldn't blame Yasmin for blacks supporting the black candidate. It's just natural that they were wishing to bring the great change over America. Until now most of the 43 presidents were British-Irish origin. For the blacks there it is really a CHANGE and HOPE.
Post a Comment