Thursday, June 05, 2008

Irish Voters May Reject the Lisbon Treaty

A new poll has just been published by the Irish Times, which shows that the Irish people might well vote No to the Lisbon Treaty. For the first time, the NOs have overtaken the supporters of the Treaty. Admittedly, it's only a small margin, but the last few days until the vote on the 12th should now be interesting.

The poll shows the number of people intending to vote No has almost doubled to 35 per cent (up 17 points) since the last poll three weeks ago, while the number of the Yes side has declined to 30 per cent (down 5 points).

The number of undecided voters is still a significant 28 per (down 12 points) cent, while 7 per cent won’t vote.

The massive increase by the No vote since the last poll has mainly come through gains among undecided voters but, even more ominously for the Yes side, it has lost some support to the No camp.

All power to the No Campaign!


Anonymous said...

Stand by for the campaign of threats, overt and implied , from the Euro class.

Anonymous said...

What disaster. The Irish have become one of the wealthiest nations in the planet under the EU. And now they look set to destroy the EU. Thanks a bunch. Under British rule Ireland had a protato famine, and oppression. What is their problem with the EU making them wealthier. This is adisaster for Europe. It will destory the EU, and lead to Europe being overtaken by every major power.

Anonymous said...

I think ther Irish have just killed the EU. Just when I was starting like them. The EU turned Ireland from one of the poorest nations in Europe to one of the wealthiest. Now when some poorer nations join they want to draw up ther draw bridge. What bunch of cheats, and support the English imperialists line.

Anonymous said...

bhuíon nách fann d'fhuil Ghaeil is Gall,
Sin breacadh lae na saoirse,
Ta scéimhle 's scanradh i gcroíthe namhad,
Roimh ranna laochra ár dtire.
Ár dtinte is tréith gan spréach anois,
Sin luisne ghlé san spéir anoir,
'S an bíobha i raon na bpiléar agaibh:
Seo libh, canaídh Amhrán na bhFiann.

Sons of the Gael!
Daughters of the Gael!
The long watched day is breaking;
The serried ranks of Inisfail
Shall set the EU quaking.
Our camp fires now are burning bright;
See in the east EU's dark night,
Out yonder waits the Saxon foe,
Drive out the EU tíoránach!

Go, Ireland! Vote no and save democracy.

Johnny Norfolk said...

I hope it is true.
When you think how the Irish have faught for independence for years to give it all up to the EU.

I hope they vote no and save us all.

Jon Worth said...

You missed the important point Iain, so keen are you that the Irish agree with your opinion. 30% of those saying they will vote no say they are doing so simply because they don't know what they are voting about - i.e. the no vote is motivated by ignorance. Principled no voting I can understand, but 'we don't know, so no'...? That's surely something else altogether.

Yak40 said...

I'm sure there's lots of empty boxes in a warehouse waiting to be stuffed with the required number of "Oui" votes, the De Gaulle Referendum School's techniques continue !

Word verification: fuukigiu, same to you fella.

David Lindsay said...

They have never really grown used to not being part of something bigger.

They only went into the Eurofederalist project because we were doing so, and the subsequent thirty-five years of Brussels government by proxy have been, and remain, a seamless continuation of the preceding fifty years of London government by proxy.

Yet they rejected Nice.

We can only hope that the penny is almost literally dropping: £50 billion in EU largesse is only one third of the £150 billion that their fisheries have lost as a direct consequence of EU membership.

And the whole thing, both in itself and because it is an integral part of globalisation, has homogenised Irish culture and society to within an inch of being totally indistinguishable from the culture and society of anywhere else on earth.

Manfarang said...

Fine Gael MEP Gay Mitchell is confident that the majority of the party's supporters will vote Yes.

Anonymous said...

Sea Shanty Irish here:

Iain, check out item in Irish Independent re: your gallant No allies from breakaway Republican faction (thinks SF too soft) were driven from a prime campaign photo op in the heart of Dublin, by inablity to respond to the Irish-language banter of the leaders of Fine Gael and Labour:

Anonymous said...

Seems eminently reasonable to vote against something that you don't understand.

Anonymous said...

The Irish Government will say that the question wasn't clear and therefore they should run it again - and they will keep saying that until they get a yes vote.

Anonymous said...

Johnny Norfolk said...
"... the Irish have faught for independence ..."

You've been using the Leprechaun Dictionary again.

scott redding said...

It will be interesting if the talk of a standing army for Europe will affect the Irish vote, i.e. being a neutral nation.

Anonymous said...

Jon Worth , you surely do not think it is sensible for someone to vote Yes when they do not know what they are voting for. The whole point of this constitution is to get it accepted before anyone really knows what is in it. There has been no discussion of it in any news media and in UK our crooked government are not even giving us the option of voting on something that nobody is willing to explain.

Armchair Sceptic said...

Fantastic news of this poll.

Let's see what the dirty reaction from the European Commission is.

Newmania said...

This is fantastic news and I am suprised , various articles had reported that was a feeling of rebbellion in the air and I have wondered if the entire political establishment foreign bullies and the media being against Ireland has made them dig their heels in.

Dirty Eurpean Socialist appears to be saying that the rest of us have been defrauded while the EU stuffs gold in the mouths of a people who are vastly wealthier than us per capita already.
They would argue that that acyually the EU has stolen their natural resources given it back as grants thus converting them into a slave state beholden to an undemocratic mega-bureaucracy.Now the EU wishes to put a stop to the fabulous properity that low tax government has delivered.

Which is it DIrty ES has England been conned or are the Irish right ?

Well !!!!???

Old BE said...

DES: The Irish got rich by having a low-tax, deregulated, knowledge-based economy.

Anonymous said...

Oh, it was a hoot listening to RTE radio news this morning trying to put a pro-EU gloss on this item.

RTE's words came down to these points:

Firstly 'It was because the people do not understand the treaty'

Secondly 'Anybody voting No would be unpatriotic'

What was not mentioned was whether the prospect of a Federal Army (Yugoslav style) eventually coming over to 'enforce' EU directives in a manner like the 'Black and Tans' was at the back of voters' thoughts.

Thinking 'such a thing could not happen in this age' is just delusional - you have to make SURE.

As for people not 'understanding', perhaps the Irish can see a pig-in-a-poke when one is presented to them.

Jabba the Hutt must be a worried man.

Vienna Woods said...

I do hope that the Irish scupper the EU monster before it totally wrecks our independence. There is hardly a country within the former "common market" club which would win a free vote from its citizens in a Yes/No referendum.

This EU horror that has proliferated over the last 10 years or so is a despotic socialist regime which gives not a jot for democracy and is lauded over by politicians from countries half the size of Birkenhead.

Our MEPs that get their feet under the table are soon entrenched with the idea that they too can experience a never ending "jolly" at our expense and are solely interested in prolonging their stay ad infinitum.

Anonymous said...

Jon Worth – please explain, in the case of not understanding the treaty, why should voting no be less principled than voting yes ? Seems most sensible to me. The treaty should not exist if a clear case cannot be made for it.

But then, we know the reality. It was deliberately made obscure to suppress debate. One of the commissioners (forget which), is on record openly boasting of this fact


neil craig said...

With luck it will be like the Major election - because the media are so heavily slanted & all respectable" opinion is for the constitreaty people may be reluctant to admit that they are going to vote against.

On the other hand do we feel lucky.

I suspect the end result of a No vote would be Ireland getting the sort of associate membership Norway has - which would be a great improvement for them but leave the juggernaut to continue rolling over the rest of us.

Anonymous said...

Well said Judith.

Anonymous said...

The EU is a bureaucratic behemoth with no reverse gear. An Irish no vote, whilst welcome, will not be allowed to derail the project of ever closer union. They ignored the wishes of the people of France and the Netherlands, Ireland will not be allowed to stand in the way.

I am always surprised that people think that democracy has got anything to do with the EU. It is, and always has been, a construction designed to negate democracy, on the grounds that democracy led to people like Hitler getting to power. The EU is designed so that, behind a veneer of democracy, Europe will be ruled by a self-perpetuating caste of elite bureaucrats. They have been getting away with it for a long time, I don't think a million voters in Ireland will stop them.

Anonymous said...

Iain, what are the chances of our getting a free vote in this country under a new Conservative government?

And if not, why not? What is more important than national self-determination?

Anonymous said...

I spent last week in the Republic. My brother (who lives in Dublin) is voting yes, while his wife is voting no. We had some heated debates. (I think they both voted Labour at their election, I know I know :P)
As you discussed in your Irish election programme on 18DS the number of signs and posters is huge. There tend to be more 'Vote Yes' posters than 'No' posters. All the main parties are campaigning for a Yes vote, so their throwing their resources at it. The only party putting its name to 'No' is SF. The other 'No' Campaign is run by a group called 'Libertas'.
There is surprisingly little about it on Irish Talk Radio stations.
I think the mere fact that the main parties are all 'Pro Treaty' feels a bit like a stitch-up and may account for the No Camp polling high.
Where I was staying in the rural midlands of Ireland there were an unusually high amount of 'No' posters in the town. (+ It isn't a SF stronghold!)

Anonymous said...

lavrentiy beria said...

"I am always surprised that people think that democracy has got anything to do with the EU."

I'm not sure they do.

The important point is to ensure that eu politicians are shown up as the traitors and liars that they are. Then everyone can truly enjoy the grisly punishments that will be inflicted upon them when Europe frees itself.

Little Black Sambo said...

"Principled no voting I can understand, but 'we don't know, so no'...?"
It's a very sound principle to vote no until you are persuaded of the need for change. If is not essential to change it is essential not to change.

Anonymous said...

traight Irish men and women. Please do our european continent a favor and vote NO to the lisbon treaty.

I ask your help for us all from germany. Most people in the 27 country's are NOT AGAINST the european union but AGAINST an EU of the big busineses. Against an antidemocratic not even to say a faschist EU which do not care about their people. Wich do not care about our children and which do not care about peace.

They only care about foreign ressources which they want to "secure" for europe by means of war if neccessary.

They want send our children into death, just to secure their profits.

Again, good people of ireland. Remind your history as a strong and free nation as well as remind your responsibility for other european nations who dont have the opportunity to decide.
God bless you..

Anonymous said...

I myself voted no and will again when they come back a second time. The EU will keep harassing us until we vote yes this is not democracy this is fascism at it most sinister.

Remember hither and the night of the long knifes well this is something that they have studied and learned from. Why do you think that they are still ratifying the treaties in the rest of Europe when we voted a resounding NO.

Just look up the commission's vote on the amendment 32. PLEASE and then you decide.