Wednesday, November 12, 2008

Conservatives Must Abolish Dartford Crossing Toll


On Saturday the toll for the Dartford Tunnel and Bridge rises from £1 to £1.50. For the mathematically illiterate among you (that would be the ones that support Gordon Brown's economic policy), that's a rise of 50%. Fifty. Per. Cent.

More than 150,000 vehicles every day go through the tunnel or drive over the bridge. There is approximately £2 million of revenue each week. When the bridge was built in 1991 there was a commitment to end the tolls once the bridge was paid for. This occurred in 2003, yet five years later we are still all being fleeced.

At the time, the then Transport Minister Stephen Ladyman said that tolls would continue. He said: "We had a public consultation in 2000 about what we should do about the tolls and the public came to the conclusion the best thing was to continue the toll as a congestion charge." Which of course is utter bollocks. The toll booths actually cause congestion rather than prevent it, as anyone who uses the tunnel will tell you. If traffic were free flowing there would be much less congestion and much less pollution. It doesn't take Einstein to work that out.

Locally, there has been an outcry about these raised charges. So much so that residents of Thurrock and Dartford have now been given a massive discount and will only have to pay 20p per journey. I am sure it is pure coincidence that these three seats happen to be very tight Labour marginals.

This Dartford stealth tax toll is iniquitous and should be ended. Perhaps the Conservatives might like to think about committing themselves to abolishing it completely, as they originally promised in 1991. I feel a letter to Theresa Villiers coming on...

38 comments:

Anonymous said...

If the Lottery is a tax on stupidty, the toll is a tax on people daft enough to live in Dartford.

Anonymous said...

"For the mathematically illiterate among you (that would be the ones that support Gordon Brown's economic policy), that's a rise of 50%."

I think it is worth reminding you Iain, that it is the Tories and their support for the 'Public Private Partnership' which gave rise to these monstrous deal whereby banks buy the future receivables for these deals and are able to profiteer at leisure.

So fatuous references to Labour do ring rather hollow, when it is only the fact that Labour are copying the failed policies of the Tories which is giving rise to the 'highway robbery' on things like the Severn Second Crossing, which has already paid for itself, but which will be charging exorbitant tolls for another generation...

Welcome to democratic capitalism, Western style...

Iain Dale said...

You didn't read it did you? The Conservatives committed to abolish the toll once the Bridge was paid for. This happened in 2003.

Doh.

Anonymous said...

Quite right Iain. The energy required every day, to slow 150,000vehicles down from 70mph to 0mph then accelerate back up to 70mph must be huge. Being both mathematically illiterate and NOT supporting Gordon's economic policy, I can't work it out.

Anonymous said...

I totally agree with you Iain.

Aisde from the fact that it is the right thing to do, if the Tories scrap it, they'll be guaranteed a LOT of votes.

Benny said...

Why are these trolls always anonymous?

Anonymous said...

Iain, this is my point - Labour promised to remove the tolls on the Second Severn Crossing when that was paid for - but for both of them, the lure of keeping their banker friends sweet with ongoing guaranteed profit trumps promises to the democratic electorate every time...

Trying to pretend that the Tories do not have the same condescending view of the voters that Labour do is not giving the whole picture..

Bill Quango MP said...

Benny said...

Why are these trolls always anonymous?

Anonymous Tolls surely

Anonymous said...

Abolish tolls on the Dartford Crossing? Sounds like you've been reading the CWF pamphlet STOP THE WAR AGAINST DRIVERS.

Looks like Boris has been reading it too. He's following up its advocacy of Shared Space schemes.

Swindon has also been blazing in its wake, taking up its call for the abolition of speed cameras.

Who would have guessed, when it was rubbished by well-known bloggers a year ago?

CherryPie said...

That is an outrageous price increase!

Anonymous said...

It was almpst certainly a very bad deal but the Severn Crossing Bill (passed under the Conservatives) was very clear. Tolls are to be charged until they reach £1bn in 1989 prices when the bridge reverts to public ownership.
That is something like three times the cost of bulding the crossing and strengthening the 1968 bridge 9in real terms). However bad it may be a contract is a contract and to break it would be hugely expensive. If Labour ever did promise to scrap the tolls it was a stupid promise to make.

Anonymous said...

What annoys me most is the sheer powerlessness I feel in the face of this. I wouldn't use the word "stealth" - this is brazen theft justified by ministerial lies (every morning I get stuck in the congestion caused by the toll booths). And yet what can general public do about this? In this marxist state, nothing.

Anonymous said...

Oh how I look forward to the day when contributors to blogs have the guts to disclose their genuine identities instead of hiding behind the description of "anonymous".

Anonymous non-entities perhaps?

Shaun said...

"For the mathematically illiterate among you (that would be the ones that support Gordon Brown's economic policy), that's a rise of 50%. Fifty. Per. Cent."

Well there *are* a generation of teenage drivers largely educated under nuLabour so that's probably a fair few...

Anonymous said...

God that things looks ugly. I am pleased I live somewhere nice.

Anonymous said...

The Conservatives campaigned against this: http://snipurl.com/5czo9

Man in a Shed said...

Labour - happy for devolved Scotland to abolish tolls, but at the same time fleece the English.

Remember in England Labour got less votes than the Conservatives - they are a foreign occupying government in devolved matters like this and act like one.

Anonymous said...

So what, both Mersey Tunnels have been £1.40 each way since April. If you're going to abolish tolls, then the old tunnel is some 74 years old and has been taking tolls almost every day since then.

Now that tolls have gone on the Forth, Tay and Erskine Bridges, the Mersey Tunnels should be incorporated in any similar pledge for London

Anonymous said...

The Tories had little interest in the issue locally until UKIP campaigned heavily on the subject, and even then, their dedication to fighting the tolls was muted at best, being used more to pre-empt UKIP. The real leader of the campaign against the tolls is UKIP Leader Nigel Farage MEP, who has taken part in a number of protests against the charges. Local Tory councillors felt so strongly about the charges that they, er, voted to take a share of the cash.

Anonymous said...

I recall using the first Dartford tunnel with single lane traffic. Strangely I have never had a problem paying the toll and was happy to continue paying £1. £1.50 is just taking the p*ss though - hardly like NuLab at all then!!

Anonymous said...

dare I mention the Humber Bridge, which now costs £2-70 each way, & the only alternative is to not go or drive 100+ miles

Unknown said...

Iain - I understand your frustration. It seems a large increase.

But bridges do cost money to maintain. If the crossing is not to fall into disrepair, the money has to come from someone.

We get the money from:
(a) all taxpayers, or
(b) the people who actually use the crossing, with a small supplement from all taxpayers.

If we abolish the toll, we get (a), and everyone foots the whole bill, including taxpayers who will never use the crossing.
Isn't (b) a little fairer?

I know your post was about government promises broken, and I accept that. But on the wider point of 'who pays?', isn't this the right policy?

PS. I know nothing about the funding structure for this crossing, or whether a PFI partnership is in place.

Wrinkled Weasel said...

This, like other toll deals is a hang-back from the days when PFI was seen as a godsend and not the theft of public money that it turned out to be.

In the old days everybody thought it was a good idea and everybody soon realised it was not, except, for some reason, Gordon Brown, who still believes in it, but not enough to include the cost in his public borrowing accounts.

Bridge Tolls in Scotland have been pretty much abandoned on a cross party basis. I think the reluctance to do likewise in England must be the current administration's dislike of being seen to admit it is wrong, together with the cost of paying off the PFI creditors.

Every PFI from the Channel Tunnel onwards has cost the tax payer more than it would had it been financed from the Exchequer. It is dead in the water. Only mad Brown is clinging on to it to disguise the level of public borrowing.

Catosays said...

We had a public consultation in 2000 about what we should do about the tolls and the public came to the conclusion the best thing was to continue the toll as a congestion charge."

Oh really? The public came to the conclusion....Did they?
I don't think so.

Anonymous said...

But there is no price increase if you now obtain a tag.....You didn't mention that did you

Tony said...

I would have less objection to paying the £1.50 toll each way if the revenue was used to fund a new and smoother crossing east of the QEII.

Anonymous said...

Get a tag, keep paying £1. It's a ruse to get us all on tags so that they can get rid of toll booth staff. Also note that it will be completely free between 10pm and 6am - think of the staff costs saved.

Anonymous said...

As Graybo says, and this should probably be in the original post to give a more complete picture, there will be no toll for motorists to pay at all between 10pm - 6am under the new arrangements. It should of course be completely free by now as was originally intended.

Not sure how much you'd save on staff though as I think they just have the coin machines during the night anyway.

Anonymous said...

I agree that this increase is outrageous.

I think the principle should be looked at, not just this one off charge.

What is wrong is that these tolls are (just like the congestion charge in London) are politically motivated money raisers aimed at the few to pay for labour extravagances.

In France there is a very simple system of tolls on all autoroutes it is a reasonable amount that pays for the excellence of these roads.

What Mr Cameron needs to do is plan for this type of system throughout the UK. Surely this would be fair? The resulting toll for the bridge could be lowered to, say 50 P, for example.

Twig said...

If you want to scrap the toll on the Dartford crossing then vote UKIP!

(same goes for the EU constitution)

Anonymous said...

I would be happy for the £1.50 to be charged, day AND night, if the surplus were to be used to build a bridge to the WEST of the current site - perhaps from Dagenham to Belvedere. Once that had been achieved, then the Dartford tolls should be abolished.

Anonymous said...

Perhaps the Tories should also campaign for the vital new Thames Gateway Corssing which has just been axed.

By Boris.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/nov/06/travelandtransport-carbonemissions

Anonymous said...

Try using the Humber Bridge at £5.80 return especially when choice is further restricted by having most of the medical services on the North Bank.

Get free passes if you are visiting people in prison though -

Anonymous said...

While I could just about get my head around the logic of keeping the toll in place if there was any prospect of another toll bridge being built nearby (thus avoiding congestion on the old free crossing while the new toll crossing takes longer to pay for and isn't used to full capacity) the increase is - and I really can't find another way of putting this - taking the piss. Injustice of the additional charge notwithstanding, the queues will snake back even further as the toll plazas try to cope with all the drivers with no change as well as the uninformed ones blocking the autobooths by chucking a quid in and wondering why the can't pass.

Anonymous said...

The Dartford Crossing tolls is one of the reasons Iain that no-one trusts any politicians anymore and we just have to put up with being ripped by the State.

It was always promised that once the Dartford Tunnels were built, there would be no toll once the cost had been paid for. Then the Bridge was built so the tolls continued. To be fair, that was OK, everyone thought it was a fair deal.

However, the deal was that once the Bridge was built and paid for then the tolls would come off.

Now they are going up by 50%.

Whenever Blears and Co, whinge on about why it is that people hate politicians and think they are liars and think the state is only inetrested in their money, the example of the Dartford Tolls should always be quoted.

Anonymous said...

In addition to the money taken in tolls there is the extra spent on petrol by everyone spending half an hour or more inching forward in the queue to the toll booths.

It is nonsense to say that people who use it should pay for the upkeep - it's part of the M25 and we all pay for all of it - what really pisses me off is how much of my life I spent in a queue that shouldn't have been there in the first place

Unknown said...

If you think that the Con party would scrap the charge you are sadly mistaken - there is too much money coming in. However. A hypothetical question. What would happen if the tunnels and bridge were in France? I would suspect that six lorries in each tunnel and on the bridge with their tyres punctured might see a rapid rethink regarding the tolls.

Paul Gilden said...

Perhaps someone would be able to calculate how many thousands of tonnes of co2 get pumped into the air as a direct result of this tax and "jobs for the boys"[ the directors etc of the managing company ]. just typical of thoughtless self-centered, jobsworths that run this crap country ! The worst thing is they are breeding exponentially. Oh to escape !