Jonathan Isaby on
Three Line Whip has a very informative post on likely LibDem resignations, who are said to include Alastair Carmichael, David Heath and Tim Farron. Many more and the LibDems will be able to hold their weekly so-called Shadow Cabinet meetings in the proverbial telephone box. Isaby tells us that there may well be a raft of junior spokespeople voting for a referendum, but under some bizarre LibDem rule, they would not be expected to resign following their blatant ignoring of a three line whip. The question the rest of us are asking is quite simple. Who on earth did Clegg not give his party a free vote? He could have made a virtue of it.
UPDATE: Verity has been complaining that all I have writtemn about today is the LibDems. I can do no better than repeat this comment from someone who calls themselves "bye bye LibDems".
It's all about Lib Dems today because we are being treated to the spectacle of them starting to tear themselves apart. It's similar to dog fighting, but with added handbags.
In some ways it's like watching the sinking of the Titanic.
Correction: it's like watching the sinking of a rowing boat.
73 comments:
I commented else where but repeat it here. I think Nick Clegg gambled and he may well have critically damaged the Lib Dems. They are pro europe the country isn't but they might as well have stayed true to themselves than try to get euro sceptics to believe they are for them with shouting for a referendum. There position in the past of building through councils and putting forward suggestions of this is what we would do.. and knowing they would never get implemented has done them well. This action of flying in the face of everyone and then sitting on the fence will only hurt.
Even if people dont agree with what you have to say they have more respect for someone who stands by what they say, rather than an opportunist or ditherer and they are both and failing.
Lib Dems, Lib Dems, Lib Dems, Lib Dems.
Now for something completely interesting: It looks as though Hillary may strike a deal with Obama, which is rather scary, because it would work.
As a pair, beating McCain would be a cakewalk. If Hillary stays the course for eight years, that gives Obama eight years to learn how Washington works - which he doesn't know at all just now - and to build his own base and alliances. And eight years of exposure to the international world.
From this strength, and given his charisma - which works for some -it could mean the Dems occupy the White House for 16 years. Chills down the spine.
During those 16 years, China and India will be coming along quietly and by the end of that 16 years, power will have begun to seep away from the United States.
Mark my words.
Lib Dems, Lib Dems, Lib Dems, Lib Dems.
Isn't it about time you had a picture of Verity peeking over your shoulder in your front page photo?
It would be a real shame for the Lib Dems to lose David Heath. I'm originally from his constituency (I come from a small town you've probably never heard of...) and he strikes me (even though I'm of a different party) as a bloody good MP, both in parliament and in the constituency. He's also from the area, which is always nice.
There's no question Nick Clegg should have offered his party a free vote on the referendum. It was the principled choice and also the best option for his public profile. He'd have gained respect. Instead he's come up with a Euro pudding of a position that doesn't make any kind of sense. For the shooting yourself in the foot award it's nearly up there with the bottled election. Except of course half the country probably don't know who Nick Clegg is.
All your sneering won't stand in the way of the resurrection of Liberal England. The Tories can bray all they like, they can't stop the force.
Iain - Re your your reference to moi-self, I honestly can't see that it matters whether the Lib Dems rip themselves apart or stay together. What possible potential impact on Parliament does a Lib Dem have one way or another. They are absurd. They even have a "front bench". Oh, please!
I doubt anyone loves Verity ( in a pure and chivalrous way ) more than I do... deep deep sigh ... but do keep the Lib Dem torture coming Mr.Dale
Wake up all, he has done a deal with Brown for power .He has a promise of a place in the cabinet tucked into his Old St. Paulian underpants from when he wiggled for Brown as a political lap dancer.
We know they are in negotiations for PR ...do you think the subject just didn`t crop up? Why else would he have stuck with this bonkers plan ..its a crazy gamble for such a new leader however strong his private wish to abolish Britain.
Clegg has sold out, Clegg is a traitor to his Party his country and ...his netball team if he belongs to one.
I said some time ago this would happen - half will go the Tories reluctantly and the other half will go Labour less reluctantly. In any event less than 20 seats for the rump next time round
me thinks you protest too much about the LibDems...
What's the problem - feeling threatened? :)
go on - throw the dog a bone -
write something like "Is it all over for Obama in the Democrat primaries after Ohio and Texas?"
it'll give Verity something to choke, I mean chew, on.
Bloggers care. The country just doesn't.
The big question is this:
Is this the self destruction of the Lib Dems or is it just Nick Clegg ?
That, Verity, is what has everyone so interested.
My answer would be that that it should be Nick Clegg's funeral, however I suspect the Lib Dems in general will be doomed. Half of their Mps should start polishing their CVs now.
Actually it's rather like watching the Tories for the last decade and a half has been...
They were never a proper party, but more of a None Of The Above franchise extended to people representing totally different things in different parts of the country. And their latest goings on are quite beyond deranged. So, is it now all over for them?
With regard to what Verity writes. I don't care about her; so don't feel you have to justify yourself to her. After all she doesn't even live on these shores; so can hardly have the best interests of the country at heart; given the fact that she cares so much about this country she moves 8,000 miles away!
False, David Lindsay. Liberalism/radicalism has a long and proud history in this country. the old Liberal Party is responsible for most of the advances that have been made in this country, including unemployment/health insurance, falsely claimed by Labour as theirs. Just go to Wikipedia and look at the page "Liberal Reforms" for a record of what I did as prime minister 100 years ago.
As for the 21st century? We were the first to speak out against the Iraq adventure when the Tories were all for it. Little Davey Cameron changed his mind when he realised we were right, but we got there first.
Unlike the Tory Party, which is full of authoritarians like Michael Howard and Tim Montgomerie (cf: The Devil's Kitchen entry on him, 18/10/2006 (et passim)) we have always been against ID cards, because it offends our liberal sensibilities to extend state control in such a way.
We pioneered environmentalism. To this day clunking fist does next to nothing about it, and half the Tory Party hates the idea of conservation. And time will tell that we had it right on Northern Rock; that and criticising the general culture of reckless personal spending and debt.
We will reverse the ossification of the class system which occured under Thatcher, Major, the vicar and clunking fist. In short, we will do what the Tories say they will. Not with false hopes like grammar schools, with a real hope for people born into poor families.
One would search in vain for liberal policies from the other parties. Certainly Dave Snooty and his pals will do no such thing.
Proud to Be British - Driven out by the foul, deceitful malice of tony blair and his grand design to rend Britain apart, the foetid socialists in general, the soft, ever-braying socialist wing of the Conservative Party and, I suppose the Lib Dems as well.
Blair was never held to account for the harm he deliberately did, in the service of his own advancement in the world, and Dave is another Blair although not quite as toxic. But nevertheless, not worth voting for.
I believe, Proud to Be British, that I am just one of around 3m of my countrymen who also, sadly, voted with their feet. I still, however, have a vote and will be employing it.
Asquith:
You're a grand chap, but your last post worries me.
Since when did Prozac become the young person's recreational drug of choice?
Proud to Be British, but I hope not proud of your geography - the distance is closer to 4,000 miles. Not your grossly exaggerated 8,000 miles.
looks like Verity got off the leash before my comment was published
given the current electoral standing with the Cons ahead but not in an unbeatable position the Lib Dems could hold thebalance of power in the next election. Hardly an original thought I know. But if they do then they will undoubtably extract some electoral concessions from whoever they form a government with. But who would it be I wonder?
Interesting implosion.
I reckon a litlle meal, then a deal, in the Margarita restaurant in Washington between Hilly & OB makes sense - there are precedents!!!!
Iain - wasn't it a taxi?
for chrissake Iain just set up a "Hilary is the devil and Obama is her bitch" thread and get Verity off this one.
After PMQs, the Daily Politics show said the story about the LibDem resignations was 'pants'. Suppose I'll have to wait until after the vote to see if the 'vows' to resign were 'aspirations'.
Given the fairly stagnant polls, here and elsewhere, on the state of the main parties, I have to side with Iain (and others here) and believe the biggest threat to a Tory win in the next election lies with debunking the LibDems. I see them only as vote-robbers.
proud to be british...does that mean if you work and have to live abroad or having worked abroad and cannot afford to come 'home' or you are happy in the new surroundings you cannot or should not have love for and feelings for your mother country?
Grow up man/woman. I have met many British people on my travels, in China, Singapore, most european countries, USA, Canada who are as, if not more, patriotic than myself.
I only wish I was 8.000 miles away from this rotten, incompetent and corrupt government.
verity said ... "Iain - Re your your reference to moi-self, I honestly can't see that it matters whether the Lib Dems rip themselves apart or stay together. What possible potential impact on Parliament does a Lib Dem have one way or another."
LibDems are important because, in the event of a hung Parliament, they could hold the balance of power.
Why are Brits allowed to vote for up to 15 years after they've moved abroad? OK, maybe up to 5 - 15 seems excessive.
Either that, or we should have a permanent right not to be disenfranchised.
Iain please dont mention Verimort or "she who must not be named".
Too late - only Quentin Letts can save us now!
The Liberal Democrats have probably done a deal for a changed electoral system and a place in cabinet with both Conservatives and Labour. The first makes a principled stand it will assuredly lose (thus avoiding longstanding differences on Europe surfacing) without most of the LibDems; the second imposes his decisions (which musn't be opposed or he falls into disgusting habits).
Dishonourable, and looking remarkably silly imposing a three line whip on an abstention, but Clegg and Co are dishonourable and silly so they won't mind.
I don't think it's 15,Tizzy. I believe one can vote overseas for five years after one last appeared on the electoral role.
Verity said
"I am just one of around 3m of my countrymen who also, sadly, voted with their feet."
Isnt this the ultimate political drama queeny expat cliche. I live in UK and hated the Howard government in Australia but think you'd have to be soft in the head to actually emigrate from a democracy for political reasons.
You'll just meet a bunch of people coming the other way. Stand and fight if your political principles are that important otherwise be honest about why you left and give us a break from your sanctimony.
To be honest I cant understand why people (Verity & her ilk) who decide to leave this country should still be able to vote in our general elections. Unless I am wrong they dont even pay UK taxes; so they can do a Ronnie Biggs and move back to the UK if they need NHS treatment then bugger off again.
As for the arguement that "I can't live under a labour government" hence I go overseas. So it's alright for the rest of us to pay our taxes to support the country then when you feel it is right you will rejoin us? After having paid nothing for years?
When Verity refers to herself as
"moi"
I'm trying to remember which rather quick-tempered character used to do the same....
and then I remembered who else referred to themself as "moi"
I sympathise with Verity . I was not able to stay in London thanks to Ken Livingstone and New Labour’s project to turn it into a foreign country run by Communists. How dearly to I hope to see Livingstone kicked out from my Lewes fastness though....oh how very dearly I hate that man
( Go Boris !)
kermit said...
'When Verity refers to herself as
"moi"
I'm trying to remember which rather quick-tempered character used to do the same....
and then I remembered who else referred to themself as "moi" '
That's funny. We shall forever visualise Verity as Miss Piggy.
Verity, you are all right for a good few years yet. According to the Electoral Commission website:
"If you are a British National living overseas you are entitled to vote in UK General Elections and European Union Elections for up to 15 years after moving abroad. Overseas electors cannot vote at local government elections."
anon 9.49 pm
That was never my intention...no-no-no...you can trust me on this....I'm a Lib Dem.....honest....but (God help me) I'm married to Verity....
9:49 - Yes, dear,we know. That is why we use it ironically, and, with even more pretentiousness add "self". It doesn't make sense linquistically. That's the point.
Proud to Be British, still digging, writes: they can do a Ronnie Biggs and move back to the UK if they need NHS treatment then bugger off again... Are. you. out. of. your. mind? Use your NHS? Use the NHS? Why do you think so many of us have buggered off?
So it's alright for the rest of us to pay our taxes to support the country then when you feel it is right you will rejoin us? After having paid nothing for years?
"all right" is two words and is spelled thusly, so I would add an appalling education system as one of my reasons for leaving. When I "feel it is right [I] will rejoin you"? Are you kidding? Why? What for? The pleasure of your company? The pleasure of your over-governance? Your appalling state education system? Your dangerous streets? Just a question: have you ever been out of Britain and seen how the rest of the world lives?
No. I won't be "rejoining" you.
Bruce of Arabia: think you'd have to be soft in the head to actually emigrate from a democracy for political reasons. Even if you emigrate to a democracy? Also, I would argue that Britain today is a very hollowed out "democracy".
You'll just meet a bunch of people coming the other way.
I haven't seen any, except I have observed hundreds of thousands of primitives pushing their way in for free money and accommodation as guests of the taxpayer.
be honest about why you left and give us a break from your sanctimony. You have the magic power of understanding the motives of people you don't know and have never even met, have you?
You are a fantasist. I left because there was a power crazed, destructive, malicious egomaniac by the name of Tony Blair in No 10 and he was allowed to wreck our civil liberties, our Constitition and our freedom of speech, and now the socialists are set on abridging our ancient liberties and people were frightened to say him nay. I left because I despaired of my countrymen who voted this spiteful spirit in three times.
I didn't know we were allowed to vote for 15 years, Aardvark. It doesn't seem to make sense.
Verity -
I'm sure the spics that you choose to live amongst really appreciate your constant correction of English usage...because nobody else around here does...Miss Piggy...
actually "all right" and "alright" are both okay.
yes Verity - I have met wierd people like you before. They are usually shouting in the street. I think we have had enough of your opinions to get a reasonable opinion of your personality (indeed we have). You are just a sad old woman who has nowt better to do than wake up and respond on this web site. I feel sorry for you. Was this what you thought your life would become?
anon 12.07 am
"Was this what you thought your life would become?"
Just - brilliant!
You'll see it quoted around here over and over again.
12:07 and presumably finger-tapping drunk - "Was this what you thought your life would become?"
Yes! I always had confidence!
Verity: Give it up. There's none so blind as those who won't see... and the blinkered and brainwashed idiots you are arguing with are not worth the effort. I notice that, true to type, they all attack the person rather than the arguments. I wonder why, if they think they are so magnificent, none of them countered your views on the crap NHS (I wonder when was the last time any of them went to a dentist?) and education (and transport and crime stats etc).
Like you I have no intention of ever setting foot in the place again. It is just so sad watching what was once a fabulous, safe and friendly place to live and work go so quickly down the tubes.
To be honest, I'd suggest that far-right bloggers should follow Verity if they hate this country so much. No one would mourn them. I myself will personally raid my ISA, that I'd vowed never to spend until I bought a property or faced some huge calamity, to buy certain individuals (whose names I won't give) a one-way ticvket to America.
Excellent article by my mate Johann Hari on the matter:
http://tinyurl.com/3y4rlv
I guess then Verity that just proves the old saying that if you have low expectations then you'll never be disappointed.
Truth is that, given the state of this now rubbish country, the majority of Britons would leave if they could. Happiness, democracy, and prosperity overseas in decent countries for those who can afford, and are allowed, to go there.
verity said...
"Now for something completely interesting: It looks as though Hillary may strike a deal with Obama, which is rather scary, because it would work."
Particularly as many Republicans intend to vote Democrat until they get a Republican cadidate who supports Republican policies. But,
why would they agree a deal?
Even if Hills now keeps winning she may still not get more delegates. That would leave Barmy able to claim popular support. Hills could claim that she had won in the states that usually vote Democrat.
I see the advantage in their agreeing but it would be really difficult. I wait with interest.
verity said...Proud to Be British, but I hope not proud of your geography - the distance is closer to 4,000 miles. Not your grossly exaggerated 8,000 miles.
The distance by air from London to Mexico City is 6650 miles.
Nomad - you are right,of course.
I am absolutely certain that I will never set foot in hellish England again. I won't even get routed through Heathrow in transit for somewhere else, so I don't have to encounter the whiny, adenoidal chippiness of the staff.
There was a small flock of parrots in my mango tree this morning, shrieking and scolding. It was like the commentariat on this blog, set to atonal music. Iain Dale's Diary, The Opera.
Verity said - There was a small flock of parrots in my mango tree this morning, shrieking and scolding.
Are you sure they weren't vultures?
Verity and Nomad -
These are genuine questions:
If you hate England so much, why do you spend any of your time on an English blog?
Are you still interested in what goes on in this country or do you just want everyone who reads your comments to agree that the UK is an awful place?
I really don't understand what your agenda is.
Asquith, that was the Liberal Party, not the Lib Dems.
David Lindsay, the LibDems are heirs to the old Liberal legacy. I should know, since I, myself was the last leader of a purely liberal government. I wrote 4 paragraphs about the 21st century LibDem party!
Anon 5.55: I can't speak for Verity, but contrary to your assumption, I do not hate England - in fact I quite like the place and the rest of the UK too.
But what I do hate is what the place has become over the past 10 years under this lying traitorous mendacious deceitful shower that call themselves a government. England is now not dissimilar to what East Germany was 25 years ago, and if the population do not wake up from their sleepwalking state it will very soon be too late to ever get yourselves out of the mire. The UK, and particularly England, is now the most surveilled society in the world, even more than China, Russia and probably North Korea. Ask yourself why that should be so in what is a traditionally free and easy-going country? Who benefits from all this Big Brother stuff? Not you, that's for sure. You can no longer defend yourselves in your home, you can't have a smoke with your pint, you can't find a dentist for love nor money, your transport system is completely hopeless, teenagers regulalry stb each other, drugs are everywhere, your police "services" (ha!) are so politicised and intent on meeting pointless targets that you rarely if ever see a bobby on patrol these days, etc - I could go on.
Just STOP for a minute, open your eyes and your brain, and look around you and then compare what life was like say 15 years ago. The place is an utter dog's breakfast ruled by [words deleted here as Iain won't allow them].
No thanks, I am out and I intend to stay out. I hope that goes some way to answering your genuine question.
Nomad,
I don't disagree with much of what you say, but for reasons I won't bore you with, I have to stay in the UK for the foreseeable future.
My question is still - why do you and Verity keep posting on a blog that is 99% about UK matters, if both of you have decided to never come back?
What do you hope to achieve?
11:51- Obviously, I can't speak for Nomad, or any other of the probably around a hundred or so expats posting here who have quit Britain with a sense of finality, but you ask "what we hope to accomplish".
From my point of view, not a bloody thing. Don't flatter yourselves that there are people overseas fighting to change the things you don't bother to fight for at home.
I'm not involved in Britain and have no interest in "accomplishing" anything. It's bafflement. Mystification. Watching an entire population give away their country in 11 short years - a country whose freedoms were hard won and whose freedoms were fiercely defended over hundreds of years. And when Adolph Blair got in and Herman Campbell got on the job of repressing all opinion that didn't praise the Fuhrer, the British crouched like a cowed puppy.
They have allowed all their freedoms to be slipped out from under them, they have allowed mass immigration of primitives whose belief system has been used as a rod to beat their backs, they have allowed the gruesom doublespeak of "multiculturalism" which no one in Britain wants but has been forced on them unresisted by the voters, and allowed their dissent to be silenced. They have watched the destruction of a once very respected educational system with nary a peep. They have watched crime and mayhem run rampant on previously peaceful streets with little more that a "tut tut". They have watched the police become their masters. They have watched the obscene ballooning of the public sector and the welfare sector as the government buys votes with their money.
It's a sense of bafflement and yes, admiration for people like Iain, and DK and Donal Blaney and Dizzy and the wonderful Archbishop of York Dr Sentamu and the outstanding Bishop of Rochester, Nazir Ali [Something; can't remember].
1:07- "The distance by air from London to Mexico City is 6650 miles."
So? What has that got to do with me? Surely you don't think there's only one big city in Mexico? This is a very big country.
What is it with you obsessive men who have to be proved right on every triviality? Who c-a-a-a-res how far it is from Mexico City to London? I don't live there.
Verity -
Your post at 1.48 pm was very good (as was Nomad's earlier one) and I'm grateful that you took the time to respond to my query.
I think you'll find that many posters on this blog share your dismay with what has happened to our country under NuLabour but, apart from voting every 5 years, have little choice but to either leave or make the best of a bad deal - until the current nightmare ends.
Many of us also have family ties that would make leaving the UK difficult - for now - though it's noticeable just how many professionals are leaving the UK.
However, I return to my earlier question about why you post here. So far, you've given the same reason as why people stop to look at car crashes.
But what does it actually achieve?
Anonymous 2:43 - thank you for your reasoned response to my posts. You ask: "What does it achieve?"
Nothing.
I don't expect to achieve anything. I was born in Britain and loved my country - although I have spent a lot of time overseas - until I watched in dismay as the British give it away. To the EU. And most recently to the fascists.
Even if the Conservatives get back in, it's only David Cameron, of the Chris Patten, Ken Clark tendency. He won't rescue Britain. He'll go with the programme for the sake of his own advancement in Europe.
Three million islamics in Britain. How many French came over in the years after the Norman invasion. Does anyone know?
Anon 2.43: As Verity has already pointed out to you in words of one syllable we expect to achieve precisely nothing, except perhaps to open people's eyes to what is actually happening to the UK. I too have family connections in the UK but that did not stop me from departing those shores. We communicate regularly by phone, email and visits to wherever I may happen to be, so no problem really.
As for your point about not being able to do anything until the next lot of rigged voting comes around - well, there are thousands, if not millions of people in Eastern Europe who might disagree with you. You may be too young to remember the Solidarity movement, for example, or the more recent so-called Orange Revolution, but they were a peaceful people's uprisings which eventually led to the downfall of the then oppresive and unpleasant regimes. If you are happy to be pushed around and have one freedom after another silently removed from you and your children with out a whimper, who are we to say nay? Good luck to you; you are going to need it.
Over and out on this one.
May I just add to Nomad's point on the non-violent revolutions in Eastern Europe, the Filippinos also had a (basically) non-violent revolution - People Power, it was called - and it gained such a critical mass that they got shot of Marcos and Imelda.
That is more effective than another election between politicians who are as corrupt as anything the Philippines or Eastern Europe endured. Elections only put more of the same bastards from the same club in, and there's little difference between the two parties in any event. Dave's bought into the "manmade global warming" fraud, whose raison d'être is the curtailment of international trade and capitalism.
PS - And the Berlin Wall came down with no shot fired.
Verity - there were no "French" people in England after the Norman invasion. The bizarre thing about you is you have no understanding of English history at all. Ancient or modern. It's quite funny to watch actually. Keep it up.
I'll rephrase my question for the boring pedants that infest this place. How many NORMAN people settled in England after the NORMAN invasion led by Guillaume of NORMANDY?
Anonymous (March 07, 2008 11:57 PM)
That is a really pathetic post. The Normans lived in Normandy, which is a region of France. They spoke French. It's perfectly reasonable to refer to them as French (- as did Jack Straw when, foolishly, trying to persuade the pro-terrorists at the UNO to support their own Resolutions and support the action in Iraq).
As to Verity's question, the answer is not many. Had the English been able to organise a better resistance the barbarian invaders could have been picked off one at a time. Then England would have been spared our/their class system.
Gonad 4.01 pm
Seeing as how it's "pedant time" on this blog...
Apart from in cheaply-made films, nobody says 'over and out' - the correct radio procedure is just to say 'out'.
Wherever you are in the world, you're obviously not soaking up much culture, are you?
Another Uppity Pedant - Well, we know that Nomad is not soaking up much British "culture" as he has deliberately put himself in the way of foregoing contact with it. He doesn't take his culture orders from Margaret Hodge,for example.
I am familiar with the wonderful region where I believe Nomad is, and it is actually more than likely that there they do actually say "Over and out" there.
I do hope you're not a cultural imperialist, Uppity Pedant, like Margaret Hodge, for example.
Selamat pagi, Nomad, and carry on up the sungai! Over and out!
Miss Piggy said:
"Selamat pagi, Nomad, and carry on up the sungai! Over and out!"
So, it looks like ex-pats in both Mexico and Indonesia spend too much of their time watching cheaply-made films.
Tally-ho, pip-pip, or whatever is said by Brits who couldn't cut it in this country and end up living in these 3rd world countries...
Oy bloody vay! I thought this thread had been put to bed!
Slam pag. Verity - let's keep the secrets shall we?
Another pedant - wow! your originality has really taken the wind out of my sails. How long did it take you to come up with that gem? Perhaps I have been wrong all these years about the appalling level of education in the UK; but, on second thoughts, maybe not.
Anon and uppity pedant (are you the same poster?) can chunter away blindly as much as they like. I know what I am missing and I have no regrets after a lifetime of globe-trotting that I opted not to return to those fetid shores. At least here in the sunshine I know that I will not get nicked by some gormless jobsworth for throwing an apple core from my canoe window!
Uppity P - I hope you check your tax deductions at the and of April; you may be in for a shock.
....and finally, yes they do actually say over and out in this neck of the woods - added to which I really am quite fond of the old John Mills films. Brings a tear to the eye.
Night all. And that really will be my final contribution to this thread, come what may.
Taken from a later thread, some light reading and a brief history lewsson for the cultural ignoramus at 10.31 which may go a little way to explaining why so many Brits are leaving the cesspit:
"Mrs Thatcher chose to use oil revenues to re-establish one part of the economy to its 19th Century primacy. The City of London. She was very successful in this regard but the money has gone to private individuals not to general good.
The concentration on the City led to terrible distortions in the economy because she made one terrible mistake The housing stock, which was sold off, as part of privatisation, was not renewed and this led to a shortage which has distorted the economy.
Also, she embraced the insidious new religion of environmentalism. Thus, allowing the ridiculous green mullahs to say that building more roads only leads to more traffic. So, very few roads were built under the stupid Blair. I cannot believe the mentality which says that if there is a shortage of an essential commodity you maintain the shortage. This has led directly to all this governments ridiculous road pricing policies.
The concentration on the City was carried through into the Blair years. Society was to be divided into the very rich and the relatively poor. A class of bureaucrats was imposed as well. These were divide into the rich bureaucrats and the poor bureaucrats but all bureaucrats owed allegiance to the government and the state.
If you are to maintain a system where you have a very few rich people and a large number of relatively poor people, you must do two things. Firstly, make sure that the poor are not educated properly and secondly eradicate or impoverish any professional middle class.
The first aim is very easy in this country. We have one of the worst public education systems in the world. This spews out illiterate, innumerate alcoholics who are largely obsessed with football. It was bad enough before the changes in the 1960s and the ridiculous hysteria about child safety, which means that it is possible to discipline children but now the system is totally broken.
The impoverishment of the professional classes is being achieved by stealth. The government has made the furthest advance with teachers. Teachers are now derided people who are abused by their pupils, paid less than plumbers and forced to teach a ridiculously restrained curriculum enforced by massive bureaucracy.
The next group of professionals who are getting the treatment are lawyers. This all started when Austin Mitchell MP attacked solicitors monopolies in 1986. The Blair government cleverly used divisions within the solicitors profession to divide and rule. City solicitors are to be “brought off” by allowing them to accept non-lawyer investment. This will make a few partners in the major firms very wealthy but it will have the advantage of bringing the previously independent solicitors under the control of the big city institutions. High street solicitors are to be dealt with by allowing Tesco and any other large institution to compete with them. That is to say they are to be destroyed. The only solicitors who are guaranteed to survive are criminal defence lawyers because they have statutory protection. Therefore, their income has been diminished over the years to the point where they earn about the same as teachers. Competitive tendering, due to be introduced in November, will marginalise them to the extent that no sensible person will want to become one. Barrister rely on solicitors and so their fortunes tend to follow those of the solicitors. The cream of the bar will be allowed to put themselves under the protection of the City of London. The rest will become relatively impoverished.
That leaves the doctors. They are less of a threat than teachers and lawyers and so they have been treated more leniently. They will be featherbedded into their bureaucratic nightmare.
These policies were started under Mrs Thatcher but really developed under Blair. He perfected the use of the greatest government tool, the press. Luckily “the comics” are staffed largely by lazy sycophantic time servers, like Piers Morgan, more obsessed with Cherie Blair’s hairstyle or venality, than real policy.
In ten years time the U.K. will be a third world country. Maybe not economically but certainly mentally.
We are rather like Germany under Kaiser Wilhelm II. Let us hope we never have our own Adolf Hitler, for the ground has been beautifully prepared for such a person."
Get out while the trains ares till running.
10:31- You poor little loser. Dreaming up physical characteristics for people you don't know because your writing skills are inadequate to make your real point.
You stayed passively in the UK, whereas millions of us with any get-up-and-go got up and went.
Your envy and cowardice come shrieking through your posts. If you visited the large, elegant, bustling state capital I live in, and saw the streets lined with swank car dealerships, and noted the level of age and make of cars in supermarket carparks, and the number of restaurants and bars doing land office business, and banks that are open from 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. including Saturdays, for the convenience of the customer, and the number of people renovating their homes, you might think twice about categorizing this country as third world. Clearly, you have never been to a third world country. In fact, clearly, you've never been anywhere.
This country recently elected its second conservative, capitalist and progress-directed president.
Young American families coming here have to accept that their children will be put in one class behind, because local schoolchildren are forming letters and reading simple words and sentences at age four. This puts them ahead of many 16-year olds in Britain.
BTW, Bahasa Indonesia, not English or French, is the lingua franca of a huge swathe of the globe. You can't identify any one country from its use! Well over 100m people speak it as their first or second language.
Read Yet Another Happy Expat's interesting diagnosis of where you all went wrong and allowed yourselves to be bullied into being allies in the destruction of your own country.
Adios! Selamat jalan! Over and out!
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