There is mounting evidence that the backlash against mainstream parties has begun. The YouGov poll for the Sun which shows UKIP on an astonishing 19% is an indication that they, rather than the BNP, are the recipient of the "plague on all your houses" vote.
Secondly I hear a lot of anecdotal reports of Tory canvassers being abused on the doorstep and that normal poltitical campaigning is almost impossible at the moment. I suspect the same is happening to canvassers from other parties.
I have predicted the complete collapse of UKIP in the European elections.It seems reports of their imminent death were rather exaggerated. Nigel Farage's boast that they could beat the Labour Party doesn't look quite so ridiculous now, does it?
The challange for the main three parties now is how to grab back the initiative. To be honest, it's difficult to see how they can do it.
Call a general election and replace all venal and corrupt MP's with new PPC's and get a whole new parliament in. It may work to restore some trust if people know parliament is full of completely new people.
ReplyDeleteThey were the three mainstream parties.
ReplyDeleteThings are changing.
People should think very carefully about who they vote for next month. Don't punish the mainstream troughing piggies just to let in some more?
ReplyDeletehttp://www.plenty2say.com
Having toyed with the idea of voting BNP to shake the three main parties I will now take the Tebbit option and vote UKIP at the Euro elections.
ReplyDeleteAt the general elections I will not be voting Conservative until we get a clear undertaking from Cameron that we will have a refendum on the Lisbon Treaty, ratified or not.
If we do not get this I will never vote for the Conservatives ever again.
This is a real tipping point for our 'political elite' because the veil has been rent asunder and we have seen our MP's for waht they are. There is no need for them as most of our laws are no longer scrutinised by Westmister. They do not hold anyone to account. They do not do their jobs. Why do we have so many of them. The same with the Lords. Too many hangers on with a hand in the public purse. At local level councillors who have no power and no means of raising money as so much has to be done in Westmister.
Then we have our Regional Policians waiting for Lisbon to raise them up so they can start troughing along with the pigs in the sty palaces of Edinburgh and Cardiff.
The cancer at the heart of our body politic is Europe which has sucked the life out of parliamentary government. We need to take back the reigns of government and become the nation state that saved Europe and the rest of the world on three occasions in the last 200 years.
Calm down Iain. Dave has come out of the expenses debacle well.
ReplyDeleteMany, many Eurosceptic Tories (including me) use the meaningless Euro elections to register protest votes to remind CCHQ that we don't like the EU one little bit.
The vast majority of that UKIP vote will support Dave at the GE.
It's Brown who will not recover.
There was certainly evidence of a backlash on Question Time last night. So-called national treasure Ming Campbell berated and Margaret Beckett, arrogant patronising and condescending as ever, demonstrating how she just doesn't get it. Handy qualities those, meaning she can constantly stay in denial. Good on the audience.
ReplyDeleteOne matter that has not helped the Tory party has been the intervention of Tebbit. Cameron should have sacked him and been more forceful in denouncing his opinions. He may well pay a heavy price for not doing so.
ReplyDeleteWe have to be careful about deciding the BNP aren't a threat when looking at opinion polls. Many BNP supporters don't say they are going to vote BNP.
ReplyDeleteMy voting pattern is the same as Patrick's.
ReplyDeleteProtest vote in European elections as no mainstream party offers leaving the EU as an option, but Conservative in general election as I am in a marginal seat and want to stop Labour above all else, but do hope that Conservative policies will sort out Gordon Brown's economic damage.
I cannot fully describe my disappointment loathing and contempt for Westminster at this time. Frankly I would/will vote for the BNP in a heartbeat given the chance.
ReplyDeleteThe devil would be my second choice, after that spoil my ballot paper!
I like you Ian, but your party NO THANKS!
Secondly I hear a lot of anecdotal reports of Tory canvassers being abused on the doorstep
ReplyDeleteThat was me !
I was polite of course, but when you throw facts and figures at Cameron's failure to oppose at some poor old Tory buffer who is dyed in the wool blue, they have no come back.
I gave him and his nice lady wife a cup of tea because it was chucking it down. He was really dispirited that so many Tory voters were going to vote UKIP in this rock solid 'former' Tory area
"The Backlash Has Begun"
ReplyDeleteQuite right too. I shall be following Norman'sadvice and voting UKIP. Not because of the corruption at West Minster but because none of the three mainstream parties represents my views on Europe.
It doesnt help the politians when they come on Question Time and refer to the voters as "You people" and then tell us we dont understand!! Good old Margeret Beckett showing she is in touch and one of the people. Why is she always smiling as well? £72,000 in the bank probably!!
ReplyDeleteThe idea of these British nationalists being 'clean' is just a laugh. They committed some of the worst cases of corruption in the European parliament.
ReplyDeleteAnd for you London-centrics, this is a failure of the self-appointed 'mother of parliaments' only. If you support Parliamentary Sovereignty, you place British MPs above the law. Legal commentators including Joshua Rosenburg (much more credible without the beard) have made this point already.
No councillors, MSPs, AMs or even MEPs are involved in this horrendous scandal. It's not a failure of politics, its British politics. Another manifestation of the UK as a failed state.
Even Conservative Party members must now realise that all this talk (yet again)about reforming the EU is NEVER going to happen.That story has been run for years and look where we are now.They can't even sort out their own crooked accounts.This time it's going to be UKIP!
ReplyDeleteIt's pretty obvious that the "vote UKIP in June, vote Tory at the GE", is the tactic for a huge swathe of voters.
ReplyDeleteThe poll difference between 41% and 29% in Conservative voting intention in the recent You Gov survey illuminates this perfectly.
Typically a voter who is deeply upset that British independence has been so subsumed by the EU yet wants to kick Brown into the very long grass.
The real story here is that whilst the Conservative vote will be split asunder in June, Labour has no safety valve to split their vote. The 22% and 19% is astonishing. They truly are in meltdown.
And this just in from Balls
ReplyDeletehttp://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/5325590/Ed-Balls-and-Yvette-Cooper-flipped-homes-three-times-MPs-expenses.html
Anne Widdecombe's disgraceful comment piece in the Independent this morning shows they still don't get it.
ReplyDeleteAnd they won't get it until they suffer the consequences.
More, faster!
Keep repeating - a UKIP MEP was sent to jail for housing benefit fraud and another is being investigated for fraud.
ReplyDeleteThey may have been thrown out but that is no different to what is happening right now.
My experience on doorstep is that those giving out the abuse or ranting are mainly those who don't vote anyway. We can tell they don't vote from previous marked registers. "A week is a long time in politics." It has been a long week and we can get back on the front foot.
The evidence of a shift to UKIP has been popping up on TV regularly this past week. TV news vox pops have heard the "Won't vote for the 3 main parties, I'm voting for UKIP" line over and over.
ReplyDeleteGreat stuff.
Crikey, I'm out canvassing tomorrow...
ReplyDeleteI was going to vote UKIP before the expenses scandal.
ReplyDeleteI am voting for them not because of the Westminster expenses scandal but because of the greatest expenses scandal of all time ... THE EU.
I will vote BNP at the next election until we get a firm assurance that there will be a referendum & wide ranging reform of relationship with the EU.
I'm also fed up with the Islamification of Britain.
I cannot stress this enough ... people are turning to the BNP because they AGREE WITH THEM, not simply as a protest. Until you political pundits get that and start to address the issues that they alone seem to be addressing you'll sink further & further into oblivion.
I canvass regularly. I am a PPC, not an MP, so I should not be tarred by the expenses scandal. I have found that people want someone to discuss and vent their splean at. I urge all activists, Tory and Labour alike, not to hide. Political activism is at a low as it is, and the electorate often go years, if not decades, in some places between visits from canvassers. Let's not make that situation even worse. I will be out tomorrow. I expect some polite anger, and I see it as my duty to take this and to explain as much as I can.
ReplyDeleteAll of this anger is merely a symptom of our powerlessness to remove those who abuse the system through the ballot box.
ReplyDeleteFix democracy and you fix everything else. Hannan and Carswell's The Plan is looking more and more prescient by the day.
If all expenses were published, and voters could actually decide which candidates then went forward into the main ballot, there'd be no problems.
Most MPs have safe seats, and are party placemen. They are therefore state-funded bureaucrats, rather than politicians who genuinely reflect the will of their electors.
Bureaucracy is the cancer within the body politic; democracy is our immune system.
This is an easy one Ian,
ReplyDeleteMP's are not quite ready to grasp the fact that it’s their denial of what’s required that’s feeding the anger and contempt. Self-pity weakness and delay only fans the flame.
Dissolution Ian, Dissolution!
Don't worry you will be safe ;0)
>>I would/will vote for the BNP in a heartbeat given the chance.
ReplyDeleteThe devil would be my second choice...<<
Evil - but consistent.
Iain said "The challange for the main three parties now is how to grab back the initiative. To be honest, it's difficult to see how they can do it."
ReplyDeleteNever was a truer word said.
Voting in the Horsham district is a bit pointless with such a large majority for Maude, and I have never really believed that a change to a Tory government would be significantly different to the current lot anyway, particularly as most of our laws now come from the euro fantasy land.
With Brown in charge I was tempted to vote Tory this time, but my attitude has hardened considerably over the last few weeks, and sorry Iain, I like a lot of what you say, but Maude won't get my vote, now or in the GE.
Maude has been very quite recently, no doubt keeping his head down and hoping it will go away, but I won't forget.
UKIPs are not paragons of virtues.
ReplyDeleteWhat MPs do here, they did in Europe, still we the tax payers pay for it through UK's contribution. These UKIP members will shout and walk out in Euro parliament back to their 5* hotels, letting the commissioners do what they want. The next time we will hear that the large numbers of UKIP MEPs are at it again.
Has anyone else noticed how the online version has UKIP on 19% and a mention of them but when the paper came out they knocked them back to 15% and acted, once again, like the party doesn't exist?
ReplyDeleteIt's childish, yes, but does The Sun really hate UKIP that much that they thinks the BNP are more worthy of mention?
Brown is gone for certain. There is no way back for him personally.
ReplyDeleteNew Labour has gone the same way.
Old Labour - will struggle to survive.
The Conservatives have a fantastic opportunity. They should remove ANY party political rhetoric from ALL their interviews, speeches and other electioneering and lead the way out of this morass. Hague got the tone ALMOST right on the BBC this morning.
The situation demands a Churchillian approach.
MacKay must GO - also his wife - TODAY. Let them sue Cameron if they want. Stuff the "grandees" it is time for the new generation to assert themselves.
Cameron should - for the sake of the country & constitution - meet with Brown & Clegg within days to attempt to address these problems in a none partisan way. If Brown won't meet - call an emergency debate.
Hardly surprising. With serial troughers in all the main parties and Labour in absolute paralysis and unwilling to discipline offenders who can have faith in politicians.
ReplyDeleteSadly, my view is the majority the MP's have worked the system. Look at travel expenses and the communications amounts. There are massive differeneces. Did some of the Glsgow MP's travel by private jet?
Just when you think youv'e seen it all up pops Crappison.Down to his last 24 houses and still locked on the taxpayer teet!
ReplyDeleteThere will be a North South divide.
ReplyDeleteUKIP will win seats in former Tory strongholds and the BNP will clean up up North.
How else will the people register their disgust?
Will they continue their previous strategy of "don't vote it only encourages them"?
Interesting few weeks ahead.
It is not good on the door steps but at least they want to talk to us!!!
ReplyDeleteLet me rephrase your final sentence.
ReplyDeleteTo be honest. That's how they can do it.
I know the Telegraph has a mountain of paper to sift through but at some point it would be nice to see a summary: It can be done by party, can show a graph to show what percentage of a party's MPs over-claimed and by how much and the amount repaid. I'm sure it would be damaging to all parties but one graph could give us an instant snapshot and allow us to compare. Thoughts anyone?
ReplyDeleteDid you see Malik's interview on Sky this morning?
ReplyDeleteArrogant creep.
The Justice Minister thinks it is perfectly acceptable for the tax payer to buy him a home cinema for₤2600!
Instead of running off to the Fees Office to see how much he could spend on our tab his first question should have been 'what's the cheapest tele on the market'.
He also tried to claim for an i Pod. Farcical.
And then we have Balls n'Cooper filling their faces with ₤600 of tax payer funded food every month!
As if a combined salary of over ₤300,000 wasn't sufficient.
These people are completely unfit to represent us.
I will be voting conservative in the European Elections.
Dave could turn around all the Tory votes going to UKIP at a stroke. PROMISE A REFERENDUM ON EUROPE. It would not cost him a penny in avertising as the media would cover it 24/7. To put the cherry on the cake he could waffle on about corruption in Brussels being far worse than corruption in Westminster.
ReplyDeleteIt is that easy. So the very fact that he is NOT promising a referendum on Europe tells you all you need to know about EURO CAMERON.
Yes, vote UKIP in the euro election and Tory (if they are lucky) in the general election. It really is a no brainer. The Tories are utterly spinless on the EU (and much more) so voting UKIP in a PR election is effectively a refeferendum on not just the EU but by extension our current political/constitutional settlement which has outsourced our sovereignty and disenfranchised the electorate leaving our MPs with little to do to justify their existence.
ReplyDeleteNever underestimate the wisdom of crowds. The public know. They (we?) know that the EU is just another troughing gravy train, and we want out. Poeples instinct that the EU is bad for them is right. They know that the EU marginalises our Parliament, although they may not be able to articulate that. They know that we've got too much Government doing too many things, things at which it is epically bad. They are beginning to wake up to the fallacy that Big Government is Good Government. They are beginning to see the bonkers money go round of taxes and grants that only serve to keep politicains in business. They are realising that freedoms have been stolen from them. And they want it sorted.
ReplyDeletePersonally I want every politician, every state employee and every quangocrat to be very very frightened of me, a free citzen. I am their master. Not the other way about. And I want the authority of the Police restored and for them to understand that they are merely public citizens to whom we have granted special powers to do something full time that we would all naturally do anyway.
And I want all that right away. Now.
John of Enfield - Yep, the Tories could easily re-invent themselves as a peoples party for samll government low taxes and freedom, but above all for democracy, accountability and integrity.
ReplyDeleteTo quote "socialism always trends to totalitarianism", and this has been proved inspades over the last 12 years.
Could this be a 'bonfire of the cameras' moment?
They have no choice but to call a general election. The people are furious and don't want this government to continue. They want an election, a "Bill of Rights" and much stricter rules for MP's.
ReplyDeleteThe Tories could eliminate UKIP in a eye-blink. All they need do is make a firm, unequivocal statement on an EU referendum. Decisive and with no 'buts'.
ReplyDeleteAs a voter, I'm sure I'm not alone when I look towards the Tories, of seeing a fuzzy, pale blue cloud... of undefinable policies.
As a voter, I cannot find the clear boundaries which define the Conservative party. And, like all groups which refuse to be direct about their intent, this leaves me feeling frustrated, somewhat powerless and annoyed with them.
Because of this alone, UKIP appear to be an attractive choice.
The clear message from last evening's Question Time was sort it out quick. Cameron can do his part by dominating the Sunday news agenda with a tranche of forced retirements - Hogg, McKay, Spicer etc, ten would do, with maybe one or two immediately and by-elections.
ReplyDeleteThen make it clear that he is having discussions with Kelly on bringing changes forward urgently; and that we will wholeheartedly support a robust report.
PS Have a good time in North Wales, fantastic bunch there. You will be raving about it on Monday.
I will vote Lib Dem at the local elections, because I know the chap and the Tory candidate is a first class berk.
ReplyDeleteI will vote UKIP at the Euros to show my utter contempt for the EU system.
And I will vote for Dave at the next GE because I am a Tory and our local MP is a non-troughing first class chap.
guido is down. is it a conspiracy Iain?
ReplyDeleteI am very fortunate Dan is my MEP.
ReplyDeletelee said - 'Good old Margeret Beckett showing she is in touch and one of the people. Why is she always smiling as well? £72,000 in the bank probably!!'
ReplyDeletehasn't she already lined up a nice little earner in europe for when it all goes tits up here ?
If the Tories had more people like Daniel Hannan they wouldn't have a problem.
ReplyDeleteIt's interesting how the voters are (judging from the polls) round on Labour and blaming them. This is almost certainly because Labour MPs have come across as arrogant, condescending, lying and indifferent to the views of voters. To a man and woman virtually, the guilty ones have repeated obfuscations, distractions, irrelevancies and falsehoods in their efforts to appear OK.
ReplyDeleteYet this has also been true of some LibDem and Tory MPs.
Clearly there is more going on here than just the self-serving venality, corruption, decadence and Marie-Antoinette lifestyles of many of our MPs. I presume people just like Cameron's approach to it more, and the facts don't matter to much. Not least that David Cameron himself in the past was one of the biggest expenses claimers, not withstanding that he is a very rich man.
Oh well. Politics as usual! Emotions matter more than facts!
Malik out!
ReplyDeleteHe has gone - BBC now!
The real crime here is that the Conservative party have allowed fringe parties to gather momentum. It is the Conservatives who should be dragging us out of the EU not UKIP and it is the Conservatives who should be ending unbridled immigration and sending home criminals.
ReplyDeleteThe tories should 'unite the right', listen to the concerns of the people and then nobody would need to even consider voting for the nutters.
The mainstream parties only have themselves to blame for this predicament, coming so close to important elections. You tried for the last four years to prevent your expenses from being made public and spent a great deal of taxpayers money on it too, over £100k so I'm told.
ReplyDeleteYou played the system and claimed what ever you could because you never ever believed that you were in any danger of having your expenses made public. You even made the rules yourselves and structured them so that whatever normal rules apply to the little people about claiming expenses, they would never apply to you lot. In other words you even gave yourselves virtual immunity from prosecution and investigation from HMRC and the Police, unlike the little people.
Are you managing to keep up?
You are very good at telling us that actions always have consequences and I really do believe that myself in life.
These were Parliaments' actions, led by the Speaker(imposed by labour when it should have been a conservative this time round as per the house conventions) and supported by the majority of the house.
But this bit is important too.
You have been found out and all you can say is that it is the system. Well pardon me, since Labour have been in power for 12 years, you never thought it was important enough to reform the system in that time? Too busy selling wars or just counting your taxpayers money? No spare time available either from not having to bother with the European Referendum Bill cos you ditched that, remember. More likely you never ever believed we would find out.
You reap what you sow, never ever has anything been more clear. We all know it, but still you don't get it. In the name of God Go!
The comments on Dan Hannan's blog are interesting ..... many comments, including mine, say that they admire him and then go on to say that they will be voting UKIP.
ReplyDeleteThe reason: Cameron's equivocation about the Lisbon ConTreaty and whether a Referendum will be held even if all member states have ratified it.
I think Labour are going to be completely hammered ... but the Tories may well come out with a far smaller share of the vote than they expect.
Looking at BBC iplayer of last nights Question Time. What went wrong, no specially selected audience, no protection of the panel. Lasts an hour, but to see Becket swinging in the wind, with that ar*ewipe face being cringing is wonderful.
ReplyDeleteTo ' grab back the initiative' your need credibility. None of the main parties have any; and nor do their leaders. They have forsaken their moral authority for a free loading spree. Its going to take a lot of hard work and penitence to recover it.
ReplyDeleteOne of the most noticable things is the way Labour people have reacted when asked to explain their actions over the expenses scandal.
ReplyDeleteBeing held to account and interviewd in the same "rough" way as has been the norm for Opposition parties over the last 12 years of Labour in power definitely unsettles them.
It seems their "hold" on the MSM by feeding their Copy-Takers with headline grabbing leaks and threatening them with blackouts if the spin is not reported no longer guarantees them their customary soft gloves treatment.
From the squirming body antics and red faces on screen to their growing indignant pleas of a Media witch-hunt comes across the clear message; "They do not like it up them".
Welcome to the real world New Labour.
Last night, on my way to an evening class at a secondary school, the groundman came across to me just to vent his spleen at the political classes.
ReplyDeleteThe anger is out there, it is explosive. I think UKIP will be the beneficiaries of really convenient timing but - if the Tories continue their current approach of mea culpa and change - the Tories will be the long-term winners from this sordid situation.
Some may think this a step too far, but if David Cameron really wishes to completely decontaminate the Tory brand, he should consider requiring EVERY sitting Conservative MP (tainted or not by expenses) through a fresh re-selection process.
ReplyDeleteA decent interval would need to pass first of course, for the full facts to emerge, hysteria to calm and for new candidates to come forward, but nothing would do more to show that the party is determined to clean up it's act.
It would of course be important that some high-profile people lost their jobs (and anyone deselected should also immediately lose the whip). An extensive cull would be ideal.
Tough on the innocent but they presumably have nothing to fear from re-selection. The important thing is the message it sends out to the electorate about the seriousness with which the party views the problem and also about handing power back to the grass-roots.
Would Labour and the Lib-Dems have the courage to follow?
General Election. Now.
ReplyDeleteI'm among the many planning to vote UKIP in the EU elections - because I support their core platform - and Conservative while holding my nose because they're the least of the available evils. As others have said, an unequivocal commitment to holding a binding referendum would go a long way towards fixing that - but will we get it? Better still, allow more direct democracy, as in California - a recall election and the ability to overrule the trough-dwellers if necessary would be a huge improvement in my book.
ReplyDeleteDemocracy in this country really strikes me as something of a sham, with MPs of every party barely even pretending to care about their employers' wishes as they help themselves to our wallets. A great many of us feel disenfranchised by the present system, with our views entirely ignored by politicians: why is this allowed to continue?
As whoever you vote for in the EU elections makes no difference, other that as a weather vane, I don see that voting UKIP will do any harm.
ReplyDeleteWhat will harm the Tories is that they do not pay attention to the feelings of the majority of this country and start backing off from the EU (not Europe, I have no problems with Europeans at all, in fact some of my best friends are European!)
All you guys planning on voting UKIP, I say UKIP if you want to. The rest of us aren't for kipping.
ReplyDeleteI'll be voting UKIP in the Euro elections and will vote Conservative in the local and general election - *if* they heed the country's clamour for a repeal of the Lisbon Treaty upon a No referendum vote.
ReplyDeleteCameron needs to think carefully about his future standing in the EU, should UKIP significantly whittle away the number of Tory MEPs.
I don't seek to embarrass Cameron but I want our country back. "Ever closer union has been a disaster for Britain" - but more so for England. I don't care if UKIP MEPs are not paragons of virtue - few MEPs are. The point is that UKIP is the only party with an appealing stance on the EU.
I hope Dan Hannan is not a casualty of the UKIP swing but even if he is, it's a price worth paying. I suspect that Dan's popularity is shoring up the Conservative vote. If he weren't standing, I bet the Conservative vote would be lower.
PS: If Cameron expelled Tebbit from the CP, he'd have to expell one of its largest donors - Stuart Wheeler.
ReplyDeleteI can't see that happening.
Did anyone spot the spelling mistake in UKIP's Party Political Broadcast last night? They spelled Brussels as Brussells! A gem.
ReplyDeletePS: If Cameron expelled Tebbit from the CP, he'd have to expell one of its largest donors - Stuart Wheeler.
ReplyDeleteI can't see that happening.
He already has - Fausty
I for one am grateful for Norman Tebbit's advice.
ReplyDeleteIt goes without saying that he knows far more what is going on inside Team Cameron's HQ than most of us. If Cameron is drifting away from Conservatism, possibly in an attempt to attract votes from Labour then we need to know. I can not see the point in voting for the New Conservative party under Cameron if it will just be a re-run of New Labour under Blair.
Just what is the fundamental difference between New Lab and New Con? I can't see any.
The current mantra that not voting for Dave is giving the Lunatic fringe a position of power is quite frankly insulting to my intelligence.
And to say that we could not trade with Europe if we were not in a political Union with Europe is equally insulting...The Chinese or Americans would quite rightly not give that sort of argument any truck .
I've never voted anything but Tory... but that will all change at the Euro elections, when UKIP will be getting my vote. It has nothing to do with 'corruption' and everything to do with the monstrosity that is the EU. If the Conservatives had the balls to depart from their 'better off in' policy they would be romping home.
ReplyDeleteI'd vote UKIP if it didn't voting against Daniel Hannan
ReplyDeleteBookseller, Blimey! I must've been asleep.
ReplyDeleteAnd I spelt expel incorrectly!
If Tebbit is expelled, I wonder if he'll join UKIP or the Jury Team.
Lola -
ReplyDeleteCouldn't agree with you more.
I'll be voting UKIP in June. Im not suprised by this poll. We need to protest against our membership of the EU
ReplyDeleteTo be honest, it's difficult to see how they can do itHow about a bit of honest house clearing: Let some independent auditors go through the expenses of all MPs and indicate the ones who have been fiddling. The party leaders then instruct their constituency parties that if they reselect named fiddlers, those crooks will be refused all campaigning support. If the buggers are still elected, refuse them the whip.
ReplyDeleteCouple of things:
ReplyDelete1. Doesn't matter how many UKI MEPs there are, MEPs dont get to decide whether we are in or out of EU- thats down to Westminster and everyone with half a brain there knows we cannot, must as im sure some would like to, work without the EU.
2. Considering we can't work without European Free trade area (the rules of which are decided in the EU) (even UKIP can't/ don't deny this), then I'd rather be in it having some say over legislation that outside it like Norway just being told we have to comply with the rules if we want to avoid tariffs but not able to shape them.
3. UKIP MEPs do not engage- nearly all of them rarely or simply don't turn up to the committees (which is where all the work is done), and so don't actually influence legislation.
4. UKIP MEPs often don't even turn up to Brussels and instead only go to the Strasburg meetings- fine you may say, but how many of them only claim a salary for the one weeks work they do a month rather than the full time job they are contracted for?
5. As others have said, you want to talk expenses scandals- 9 months for benefit fraud for one UKIP MEP (and no it doesn't matter they expelled him quickly- if they hadn't it would have destroyed them) and now charges for money laundering for another.
Please do not let UKIP get away with the utter bullshit that makes up their platform.
I am a LibDem and am pro-eu but i can appreciate a lot of what the Tories say- the EU isn't perfect- so lets talk about it using facts- i respect the Tories for doing that- I have nothing but contempt for the liars and cheats of UKIP.
I just don't believe the relative ratings of UKIP and the BNP in the latest poll. Has any one looked at UKIP's pathetic results in local by-elections? What organisation have they got on the ground to support such a huge vote?
ReplyDeleteTrue UKIP will do better than originally expected and I had thought that the media were going to give UKIP a fairly free ride in order to switch protester to Ukip rather than the BNP. But I noticed that Tristram Hunt had a go on Any Questions about UKIP's two corrupt MEPs. I can't see them get anywhere near 20%.
On the other hand there's a lot of anectdotal evidence that a lot of the protest vote will go to the BNP. Around 10% each seems much more credible
The BNP threatens the Monacrcy who are not so squeaky themselves.
ReplyDeleteSmear the BNP ok, but don't overplay a reasonably good hand.
HRM would be well advised to dump the current batch of MP's ASAP
They are not viable.