tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post7983962115915655664..comments2024-03-04T17:54:32.559+00:00Comments on Iain Dale's Diary: Arise Sir Iain Duncan Smith!Iain Dalehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comBlogger38125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-25276565017022580232007-12-30T19:42:00.000+00:002007-12-30T19:42:00.000+00:00"If honours are awarded for excellence in their fi..."If honours are awarded for excellence in their fields, why are politicians more or less excluded nowadays? "<BR/><BR/>I think you just answered your own question. <BR/><BR/>Unless you really want to explicitly honour people for excellence at being mendacious, treacherous, principleless, power-hungry little toerags.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-47279306136811872852007-12-30T15:40:00.000+00:002007-12-30T15:40:00.000+00:00@ Jafo:People shouldn't be honoured for doing the ...@ Jafo:<BR/><BR/><I>People shouldn't be honoured for doing the jobs they have been well paid for in the first place. Honours should be for something extra, and not "come up with the rations" if you work for the Civil Service.</I><BR/><BR/>Absolutely.<BR/><BR/>IDS should never get anything IMHO. He was one of the buggers destabilising Major in 1992-1997. Major ran a moral and competent government and the shenanigans of IDS and his ilk made it not just easier but actually even possible for Labour to lie about Major's effectiveness, to get away with it, and to get into power and do 13 years' worth of appalling damage. <BR/><BR/>He is Ted Heath with an even worse election record.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-90496161097458885002007-12-30T11:34:00.000+00:002007-12-30T11:34:00.000+00:00My problem with the Honours System (leaving out ca...My problem with the Honours System (leaving out cash-for-peerages) is that it is extremely "rank-conscious", in that the highest honours are reserved for those who have done very well for themselves already.<BR/><BR/>If you've managed to become rich and famous in your field, you'll get a knighthood, and if you've worked away solidly and done just as good a job - but aren't very famous or rich - you might get an MBE, OBE or CBE.<BR/><BR/>Don't care about Michael Parkinson one way or another, but why should he be knighted for doing the job he's been handsomely paid for all these years? Why should he be knighted and Leslie Phillips - 83, worked away diligently all these years and a very fine actor, but not, of course, a chat show host on TV every week, get a CBE?<BR/><BR/>All this stuff about the "People's Honours" - you can recommend people who've done fantastic sterling unpaid work in their communities for years all you like, and they'll still be awarded (if anything) an MBE etc, certainly no knighthood is going to come their way. <BR/><BR/>People shouldn't be honoured for doing the jobs they have been well paid for in the first place. Honours should be for something extra, and not "come up with the rations" if you work for the Civil Service.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-89044799801119085402007-12-30T10:18:00.000+00:002007-12-30T10:18:00.000+00:00m.hristov. You are correct. The extra clue I did...m.hristov. You are correct. The extra clue I didn't give was that Rex Harrison's ex, Elizabeth Harris, is now married to Jonathan Aitken.<BR/><BR/>Back on topic, I've mixed views on honours. On one hand, they encourage political toadying (people reluctant to speak out for fear of losing a gong). On the other, I've known people who have worked selflessly for the community who experienced real joy in being honoured.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-89877526453218833972007-12-30T08:10:00.000+00:002007-12-30T08:10:00.000+00:00I'm sorry but anyone who believes in the Honours S...I'm sorry but anyone who believes in the Honours System - or has done for the last 50 years - is living in cloud cuckoo land.<BR/><BR/>Remember H Wilson's peerages? etc.<BR/><BR/>Jobs for the boys..<BR/><BR/>And since when has IDS actually achieved anything but write a report? (not that achievement is a qualification of course).<BR/><BR/>Or Frank Fields for that matter?<BR/><BR/>Politicians think they are important. Much of the rest of the country has a different opinion:-)Madasafishhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06109237198481955714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-71767133428142669562007-12-30T02:32:00.000+00:002007-12-30T02:32:00.000+00:00Charlotte Corday. The actor is Sir Rex Harrison.“C...Charlotte Corday. The actor is Sir Rex Harrison.<BR/><BR/>“Carpet Honours“. Those that are ‘handed out with the rations’ were supposed to have been abolished by John Major but it often seems that they are creeping back.<BR/><BR/>I am sure that Tony Blair will eventually be made a Knight of The Order of the Garter or a Knight of The Order of the Thistle. Both these honours are in the personal gift of H.M. The Queen. He will also be made a life peer, if he should so wish. Sir David Steel (Lord Steel of Aikwood) is a Knight of The Order of The Thistle, as is Sir George Robertson (Lord Robertson of Port Ellen), the former Labour Defence Minister.<BR/><BR/>I have always thought that the traditional Foreign Office and colonial honours would be more appropriate for Mr Blair. This is the Order of St. Michael and St. George. Divided into C.M.G. (Companion of the Order of St. Michael and St. George), K.C.M.G. (Knight Commander of The Order of St. Michael and St. George) and G.C.M.G. (Knight Grand Cross of The Order of St. Michael and St. George). Disrespectful people referred to the recipients as follows. C.M.G. was "Call Me God". K.C.M.G. was "King Calls Me God" and G.C.M.G. was "God Calls Me God".<BR/><BR/>Needless to say, Lord Ashdown is a G.C.M.G.<BR/><BR/>Blair has a very high opinion of himself (not shared by me or many of the bloggers here) and so would be an ideal candidate for the G.C.M.G.<BR/><BR/>NB. The "Carpet Knighthood" for former Prime Ministers tends to be The Order of The Garter. Sir John Major banned "Carpet Honours" but somehow forgot to refuse The Order of The Garter for himself.<BR/><BR/>Don't worry about IDS ,Iain, he will get a life peerage, as all leaders of major parties get offered one (provided they are still around when IDS retires).M. Hristovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13916257985347991350noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-80968446425802006312007-12-30T01:11:00.000+00:002007-12-30T01:11:00.000+00:00The honours system has become like the Nobel prize...The honours system has become like the Nobel prize. If Al Gore can get one, why didn't Harold Shipman?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-72285797503767706832007-12-30T01:10:00.000+00:002007-12-30T01:10:00.000+00:00Well, I am certain Graham Norton votes Labour, so ...Well, I am certain Graham Norton votes Labour, so we can expect to see Dame Graham Norton curtseying to Her Maj some time before Gordon & The Gargoyles lose the next election.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-78927113177920678142007-12-29T23:10:00.001+00:002007-12-29T23:10:00.001+00:00PS What about Brucie , no K? What does he have to ...<I>PS What about Brucie , no K? What does he have to do?</I><BR/><BR/>Vote Labour!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-3993182316220569852007-12-29T23:10:00.000+00:002007-12-29T23:10:00.000+00:00Kylie or IDS - mmmmm tough choice. Think that I'd ...Kylie or IDS - mmmmm tough choice. Think that I'd give Kylie the edge...Paddy Briggshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17847108655078927970noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-57961027880192253502007-12-29T22:23:00.000+00:002007-12-29T22:23:00.000+00:00@ inamicus:-decades of service to the nation You m...@ inamicus:-<BR/><BR/><I>decades of service to the nation </I><BR/><BR/>You make it sound like they didn't have unsackable jobs, fat salaries and gold-plated pensions for all those decades. "Service"? They're unemployable.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-52724008466500525862007-12-29T20:48:00.000+00:002007-12-29T20:48:00.000+00:00IDS's work on social justice is muddled, inexpert,...IDS's work on social justice is muddled, inexpert, and fogeyish <BR/><BR/>It looks impressive to me and since the 'experts' have provided the scaffolding for disaster across a spectrum of social Policy I `m not sure they have any more right to squeak than the experts in architecture of the 1960s.<BR/>I look forward to a range of "experts " magically advising Gordon Brown to do what he wanted to in the first place as the expert reviews come to the conclusions they are instructed to. Amongst ‘experts’ that have been wrong educational experts deserve a special gong. The order of the self serving weasel ? <BR/><BR/>Experts on climate change have consistently misrepresented their case and what about experts in Women’s Rights . Are they likely to expertly conclude their expertise is a sham and a waste of time more akin to a Dark ages Priestly rite than empirical observation. <BR/><BR/>In my expert opinion they are not and the tiresome practice of the left of pretending that certain of their constituency are above the fray is long last its sell by date . Polly Toynbee has little difficulty finding academics to agree with her bizarre and dated religion because they are mostly the acolytes of it . Neither was it hard for the US tobacco industry to accumulate evidence against the link between tobacco and cancer .<BR/><BR/><BR/>PS What about Brucie , no K? What does he have to do?Newmaniahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11922161971821380803noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-36756562963246321132007-12-29T20:46:00.000+00:002007-12-29T20:46:00.000+00:00no 2-1 post yet?!!no 2-1 post yet?!!Stephenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09443704005301999948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-23790823357725102762007-12-29T20:38:00.000+00:002007-12-29T20:38:00.000+00:00I agree with your general point but not your point...I agree with your general point but not your point about IDS, that I disagree with completely. <BR/><BR/>Of course celebrities seem to get honours for being famous and succesful, which makes the scheme redundant, but on the subject of normal people they do include people who are honoured for staying in the same job for a long time. It seems we are rewarding people for having no ambition. Those who change employers may do just as good a job and be just as worthy for exactly the same amount of time but their efforts will not be recognised.Philipahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03440234602399886097noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-89797617888094464752007-12-29T20:37:00.000+00:002007-12-29T20:37:00.000+00:00matthew is right: you are kissing IDS's arse a ser...matthew is right: you are kissing IDS's arse a serious amount here, Iain.<BR/><BR/>I can't remember an active front bench MP getting a gong for "public service" (which is what civil servants get them for). The likes of Archy Kirkwood and Nick Winterton get them for "services to Parliament" which, if you're going to have an honours system at all, is probably fair enough.<BR/><BR/>What also really gets my goat is the leaking of certain honours, possibly by the celebs themselves (Arise Sirs Ian Botham and Michael Parkinson!) or -- equally likely -- by No 10. <BR/><BR/>If I were Buckingham Palace, I would decree that anyone's honour which is leaked before the announcement be immediately revoked.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-11733954531504332232007-12-29T20:23:00.000+00:002007-12-29T20:23:00.000+00:00I'd rather they'd knighted Emu.I'd rather they'd knighted Emu.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-40758358273016004012007-12-29T19:15:00.000+00:002007-12-29T19:15:00.000+00:00I think all of this is outdated. I would never ref...I think all of this is outdated. I would never refer to someone by their title.<BR/><BR/>It all needs a complete rethink.Johnny Norfolkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900659617233793880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-84828510704928001032007-12-29T19:02:00.000+00:002007-12-29T19:02:00.000+00:00Honours for sportsmen were devalued when Paul Coll...Honours for sportsmen were devalued when Paul Collingwood got an MBE for playing one match against Australia, scoring all of 17 runs. Shane Warne loved giving him stick about that in the next Ashes series.<BR/>Why do civil servants deserve any honour? Whitehall bureaucrats don't make any kind of sacrifice any more. They are as well paid as in the private sector, if not better. They enjoy gold-plated pensions at our expense while our own company schemes are closed down, unable to bear the burden of tax from this Government, and seemingly have a job for life somewhere in the machine no matter how incompetent they are. Isn't that enough?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-69767843343508947272007-12-29T18:46:00.000+00:002007-12-29T18:46:00.000+00:00IDS - He has not really done much work beyond his ...IDS - He has not really done much work beyond his role in the Tory Party - which was a sop to him after being kicked out as leader - a job he did badly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-68842125486685800362007-12-29T18:40:00.000+00:002007-12-29T18:40:00.000+00:00Bruce Forsyth didn't get a gong because he honoure...Bruce Forsyth didn't get a gong because he honoured Vince Cable with Alesha.copydudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15643509201486589477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-23632517237819384432007-12-29T18:34:00.000+00:002007-12-29T18:34:00.000+00:00Couldn't agree more with what Trumpeter Lanfield h...Couldn't agree more with what Trumpeter Lanfield has to say. <BR/>What a load of nonsense it all is!<BR/>It means nothing to me, if anyone else takes it seriously then that is their own fault. <BR/>Don't know why you even feel it worthy of an article Iain.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-40456850858350666952007-12-29T16:56:00.000+00:002007-12-29T16:56:00.000+00:00Iain, you just earnt yourself the Order of the Bro...Iain, you just earnt yourself the Order of the Brown Nose. <BR/><BR/>IDS's work on social justice is muddled, inexpert, and fogeyish - it just so happens that he has a larger megaphone than the real heavyweights in social policy. To suggest he deserves a serious honour for producing extended position statements for the Conservative Party is laughable sycophancy. <BR/><BR/>I thought the whole point of blogging was to escape the echo chamber of parties and press, and provide an independent voice?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-80775571999707645652007-12-29T16:43:00.000+00:002007-12-29T16:43:00.000+00:00Is my memory fading badly or did I once read a Par...Is my memory fading badly or did I once read a Parkinson article against 'honours' Lets face it he is a champagne socialist.. a Barnsley Boy as he never lets us forget! although it would be interesting to ascertain if he has done anything FOR Barnsley?<BR/><BR/>Now the clamour for Bruce Forsyth to be Knighted God forbid. The man is a failed song and dance man!<BR/><BR/>Stan Laurel never got anything.<BR/><BR/>But having said that IF it is distasteful for comedians etc to get a gong for just their careers, then WHY should Civil Servants and Politicians get anything?<BR/><BR/>Armed Services/Nurses Doctors/Ambulance and Fire Personnel and Poliuce Officers and people who do something for others and the Nation should.<BR/><BR/>Politicians should have a separate award.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-75861340257583712632007-12-29T16:39:00.000+00:002007-12-29T16:39:00.000+00:00The honours system as it stands is quite demotivat...The honours system as it stands is quite demotivating for some of our foreign office staff serving overseas. In the not too distant past I came to know some embassy staff that had served in some "difficult" places, yet they are rarely honoured for their dedicated and dangerous work. At the same time I have been aware of honours handed out to locally employed foreigners in safe locations, merely for working X number of years.Vienna Woodshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03957194230173008975noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-79207639821032622862007-12-29T16:35:00.000+00:002007-12-29T16:35:00.000+00:00You're just sore because James Blunt didn't get an...You're just sore because James Blunt didn't get an OBE... ;-)<BR/><BR/>DKDevil's Kitchenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13832949569501846730noreply@blogger.com