tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post7618571928928535054..comments2024-03-04T17:54:32.559+00:00Comments on Iain Dale's Diary: The Paedophile & the Judge Who Made a Mockery of British JusticeIain Dalehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comBlogger56125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-6522683817792804152007-08-26T14:48:00.000+01:002007-08-26T14:48:00.000+01:00Very odd indeed. So this paedo couldn't even keep...Very odd indeed. So this paedo couldn't even keep his covenant with his God, but he's going to keep his word to a judge.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-37433099147589159892007-08-26T13:41:00.000+01:002007-08-26T13:41:00.000+01:00It was reported that the judge listed the fact tha...It was reported that the judge listed the fact that this paedophile was "a man of faith" among the mitigating factors. What's that about? An atheist would have been punished more severely?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-44385769050180947442007-08-25T22:10:00.000+01:002007-08-25T22:10:00.000+01:00All paedophiles should be banged up for life. I'v...All paedophiles should be banged up for life. I've read that chemical castration doesn't work and they continue to have an unhealthy interest in children and babies even after such hormonal treatment. Therefore, they need to be quarantined. They are sick and there is no treatment. <BR/><BR/>Quoting Oscar Wilde's case is really pushing it, WW. It was a total exception and his pursuit was motivated by Bosey's father, who was a powerful man. Homosexuality has been accepted, sometimes with reluctance, sometimes with insouciance, throughout history in every society. It's a steady (approx) 4 per cent across the races.<BR/><BR/>I don't believe the Victorians were particularly vicious about gays, except for the scandal of Wilde, and a lot of that was due to Wilde's grandstanding. Otherwise, in Britain, homosexuality has been accepted as just something one is, although there have been much more conservative times than present when gay men couldn't be open about their preference. But people "knew".<BR/><BR/>But you only have to look at Ivor Novello and Noel Coward, for example, in the age not long after the Oscar Wilde age, and drag queens through the ages, to realise that in the main, humanity accepts homosexuality as part of the human condition. Sometimes society wants discretion, as in the days of Noel Coward, sometimes they don't care, as in Lily Savage and Matthew Parrish and the deeply self-regarding, boring and irritating Andrew Sullivan.<BR/><BR/>To compare this segment of humanity in which men are attracted to other adult, consenting, men to perverts who prey on children and babies, who cannot have consented, is foolish and cruel.<BR/><BR/>As there is currently no cure, there must be quarantine. <BR/><BR/>One does have to wonder about some of these judges, though. I mean, really wonder.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-40018273180530257332007-08-25T20:06:00.000+01:002007-08-25T20:06:00.000+01:00"C4' said... Anon 1:24 - In 25-years time, you, Da..."C4' said... <BR/>Anon 1:24 - In 25-years time, you, Dale and everyone will all be working for me."<BR/><BR/>Looking after you c/o HMP Broadmoor.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-71626055468239237432007-08-25T17:13:00.000+01:002007-08-25T17:13:00.000+01:00"the sentence will undoubtedly be increased. That'..."the sentence will undoubtedly be increased. That's what the Court of Appeal is for."<BR/>Indeed, trumpeter, but it's not what my taxes are for - two overpaid officials doing the job of one. We expect judges to get the obvious right first time round.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-16136689643557074732007-08-25T15:18:00.000+01:002007-08-25T15:18:00.000+01:00Anon 1:24 - In 25-years time, you, Dale and everyo...Anon 1:24 - In 25-years time, you, Dale and everyone will all be working for me.Sir-C4'https://www.blogger.com/profile/03917709983378003032noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-61136590565155887952007-08-25T09:05:00.000+01:002007-08-25T09:05:00.000+01:00"Before all the bleeding heart liberals start writ..."Before all the bleeding heart liberals start writing things like "you weren't at the court, you don't know all the details", let me save them the effort. I don't have to have been in a court to know that therapy can't cure someone from paedophilia".<BR/><BR/><BR/>One probably could with enough hard psycotherapy over a number of years. But I take your point Iain. Thhese peole should be banged up for a long time.<BR/><BR/>Don't forget there's justice and the law. The two aren't always the sameJeremy Jacobshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02014279463894807064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-30758473896415199042007-08-24T21:06:00.000+01:002007-08-24T21:06:00.000+01:00There have also been a few cases recently of some ...There have also been a few cases recently of some unduly lenient sentencing in domestic violence cases, as Natalie has blogged: http://philobiblon.co.uk/?p=2215.<BR/><BR/>Maybe we need to lock up less drug addicts and prostitutes and free up more space for violent offenders?!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-38880462718545132162007-08-24T17:15:00.000+01:002007-08-24T17:15:00.000+01:00These people by and large are out of touch with th...<I>These people by and large are out of touch with the common man.<BR/><BR/>SACK HIM</I><BR/><BR/>not the common man. anything but that.<BR/><BR/>Read BBC's HYS, then watch Trisha. Then watch the Jeremy Kyle show.<BR/><BR/>if you still believe in universal suffrage after that I'll be surprised.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-72446373855428085782007-08-24T17:05:00.000+01:002007-08-24T17:05:00.000+01:00Paedophiles cannot be cured and should not be rele...Paedophiles cannot be cured and should not be released once they have been found guilty. I don't go for the 'let's make them suffer' argument, it's a load of rubbish, but it's just common sense that they will have strong urges to reoffend. Sterilisation or prison, they should be given the option.vanfuerteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00324625018746438769noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-64387724355475563542007-08-24T17:04:00.000+01:002007-08-24T17:04:00.000+01:00The Attorney General has requested the case papers...The Attorney General has requested the case papers on freed paedophile Michael Porter so the Government can consider whether to appeal against his non-custodial sentence.Porter, 38, of Okehampton Close, north London,.............<BR/><BR/>Northern EchoNewmaniahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11922161971821380803noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-6643591587202045162007-08-24T16:24:00.000+01:002007-08-24T16:24:00.000+01:00"C4' said... Anon 1:24: STFU you socialist liar an..."C4' said... <BR/>Anon 1:24: STFU you socialist liar and pig! If anyone dares question the socialist status quo, you and your fellow socialist turds instantly libel your victims. You and your kind are part of the problem, and if that drippy Cameron follows my advice, you and your lot are going to get a damn hard kicking at the next general election. <BR/><BR/>August 24, 2007 1:41 PM"<BR/><BR/>What a strange response to a non-political comment.<BR/><BR/>No wonder no one will give you a job.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-38812782946813188162007-08-24T14:54:00.000+01:002007-08-24T14:54:00.000+01:00...but in general judges are much better placed to...<I>...but in general judges are much better placed to assess the appropriate sentence for an ofender, having heard about the facts of their case, than is any minister thinking in the abstract and trying to fix rigid one-size rules in advance to fit every case.</I><BR/><BR/>Maybe a problem rests with those people who make the assessment and suggest to the Judge that the offender is less of a concern than the crimes suggest. But that does not absolve the Judge from facing the hard facts of the offences committed.<BR/><BR/>The offender is clearly a dangerous sexual predator and no amount of excuses or explanations for his behaviour should cut any ice when it comes to sentencing. Treatment or not, common sense should dictate that someone who could commit these offences deserves a lengthy custodial sentence.<BR/><BR/>In 2003 Judge Crowther jailed a man for 7 years for raping women he lured to his modelling agency. The Judge said that: the sentence was to punish and deter offenders and to protect women. He spoke of the vulnerability of the victims and told the rapist: "You abused their trust in that situation to indulge your sexual desire."<BR/><BR/>Michael Porter abused the trust of children in a situation to indulge his sexual desire. How come he walks free?Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05936858144046032905noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-71342411416536779092007-08-24T14:43:00.000+01:002007-08-24T14:43:00.000+01:00This case will certainly go up to the Court of App...This case will certainly go up to the Court of Appeal on an Attorney General's reference and the sentence will undoubtedly be increased. That's what the Court of Appeal is for.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-55285703837352792892007-08-24T14:40:00.000+01:002007-08-24T14:40:00.000+01:00Head of Legal...stop being sanctimonious. "judges ...Head of Legal...stop being sanctimonious. "judges are better placed" Rubbish! That line is the official put down to public concerns.<BR/><BR/>These people by and large are out of touch with the common man.<BR/><BR/>SACK HIMAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-18081957529437702352007-08-24T14:32:00.000+01:002007-08-24T14:32:00.000+01:00I agree that this sounds like an unduly lenient se...I agree that this sounds like an unduly lenient sentence. That's why the Attorney General's office is considering referring the case to the Court of Appeal to have the sentence reviewed. So while this judge may have got it wrong, the system looked at overall doesn't simply allow that sort of thing. There are some checks and balances. <BR/><BR/>I think generally politicians, need to resist the urge to over-regulate the courts by imposing minimum sentences, for instance. Conservatives in particular are anxious to avoid excessive regulation in other areas and I think the same applies here.<BR/><BR/>Let me stress before anyone accuses me of doing so that I am not defending this sentence, but in general judges are much better placed to assess the appropriate sentence for an ofender, having heard about the facts of their case, than is any minister thinking in the abstract and trying to fix rigid one-size rules in advance to fit every case. <BR/><BR/>If you're not careful, by going down that route you end up with the nonsense of a Home Secretary -a Labour Home Secretary - publicly denouncing a sentence which was only arrived at by applying the inflexible guidelines laid down by his own government - as happened about a year ago in the Craig Sweeney case.Carl Gardner, Head of Legalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11623620299558039098noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-87082269447509851612007-08-24T14:28:00.000+01:002007-08-24T14:28:00.000+01:00This sort of post really really worries me, Iain. ...This sort of post really really worries me, Iain. And especially from a man who calls himself a libertarian...<BR/><BR/>Judges *read* and *interpret* the law. They do not *make* it, and nor can [or should] they be held accountable for what the law says.<BR/><BR/>I am every bit as disgusted by this sentence as you are, but there is something of the John Reid whine about the suggestion that the judge is the one "[making] a mockery of British justice."<BR/><BR/>If you genuinely believe in a free society with an independent judicial system, then you have to hold the *legislature* responsible for what the law allows a judge to decide, not blame the judge for the decision he makes. A judge, as a sort of public instrument, simply communicates the the will of the legislature. He isn't there to decide "what is right" according to his beliefs, but simply "what the book says."<BR/><BR/>To suggest that anyone who might hold this view is a "bleeding heart liberal" is - in my case at least - almost as amusing as it is ridiculous. Separation of the judiciary from "accountable government" is arguably the single most important aspect of a libertarian democracy. And I don't think you are even serious when you say you are 100% certain of his re-offence.<BR/><BR/>I share your disgust at this sentence, Iain. Really, I do. But I know whom to blame - and the judge is not the one.<BR/><BR/>Wilted rose's question is - must be, if we have a free society at all - entirely irrelevant. It is for politicians to reflect our concerns in the law, and it is they whom we hold to account when the law is shown to offend our concerns.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-78311739765194042782007-08-24T13:46:00.000+01:002007-08-24T13:46:00.000+01:00Hitch...You are in luck. I won't visit your blog a...Hitch...<BR/><BR/>You are in luck. I won't visit your blog again.<BR/><BR/>If you recall, my exact words were<BR/><BR/>"One of the people I was helping started on Heroin when she was 12. Her father, who was a dealer gave it to her. She is now 23 and off methadone for 18 months. I asked her if she had any interests, hoping I might be able to point her in the direction of something useful to do. She said, "No, I only know heroin, I have only ever known heroin, my life is only starting now."<BR/><BR/>Her father committed her, at the age of 12 to a lifetime of health problems, a raft of social problems and a lost childhood. Heroin addiction, at the age of twelve!<BR/><BR/>If, in one of those wicked hollwood scenarios, the villain had captured your daughter and gave you the choice of 12 years on heroin or a quick fiddle, which, Mr Hitch, would you be forced to choose?<BR/><BR/>Try and be reasonable. Drugs mess people up for ever and so does sexual abuse. Try not to be such a relativist and try not to justify your friend's antisocial and evil behaviour.Wrinkled Weaselhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05291551539649118631noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-11501309079586324752007-08-24T13:41:00.000+01:002007-08-24T13:41:00.000+01:00Anon 1:24: STFU you socialist liar and pig! If any...<B>Anon 1:24:</B> STFU you socialist liar and pig! If anyone dares question the socialist status quo, you and your fellow socialist turds instantly libel your victims. You and your kind are part of the problem, and if that drippy Cameron follows my advice, you and your lot are going to get a damn hard kicking at the next general election.Sir-C4'https://www.blogger.com/profile/03917709983378003032noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-61268016985112596642007-08-24T13:24:00.000+01:002007-08-24T13:24:00.000+01:00Slightly off the main point, but the person who wa...Slightly off the main point, but the person who was banged up for three months for non payment of council tax was not a penniless pensioner but someone who had fraudulently evaded payment for about 6 years and owed £9,000. An example of an exemplary sentence to deter others. <BR/><BR/>The only other sentences I am aware of were token 2-week ones on pensioners who refused to pay their council tax (although they could well afford it) and were quickly released when someone else paid it, against the offenders will.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-15065636284559070932007-08-24T13:23:00.000+01:002007-08-24T13:23:00.000+01:00F... It Im going on the attackWeaselYou came on my...F... It Im going on the attack<BR/>Weasel<BR/>You came on my blog and said that my very good friend who has just finished a 10 year sentence for cocaine dealing should have been shot , you justified that by saying that you work with drug addicts and have seen the damage that they do. Well heres something for you they were all volunteers.<BR/>Children dont volunteer to be abused , and as others have said , you were "mildly annoyed" when you son was touched up?<BR/>WTF , if anybody did that to a child of mine I would cut his f***** B*** off and happily sit in front of a jury knowing that I would not be going to prison and not care if I did.<BR/>You need to sit in front of a mirror and have a good long word with yourself about your values.,The Hitchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17007793676288933155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-23270253803550106052007-08-24T13:12:00.000+01:002007-08-24T13:12:00.000+01:00I really should read all threads before I post"reg...I really should read all threads before I post<BR/><BR/>"regularly pestered for sex by gays" weasel ?<BR/>Maybe you were hanging around the wrong places.<BR/>Homosexual men tend to be all too aware of the dangers of "pestering" a straight man.<BR/>Why should they bother ?<BR/>My experience of gay clubs and bars has been that you will see a lot less overt sexuality than you will see in a straight club , amybe thats because I have only ever been in the ones on canal street manchester or old compton street where the crowd is mixed.<BR/>The Hitch getting vexed about gay rights<BR/>I don't know whats come over me.The Hitchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17007793676288933155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-72959336400556136272007-08-24T13:07:00.000+01:002007-08-24T13:07:00.000+01:00Weasel - (sorry everyone) you appear to be saying ...Weasel - (sorry everyone) you appear to be saying your own son was sexually molested by a Boys Club leader and you were "mildly annoyed"? "Some have twisted this into a hideous crime"?<BR/><BR/>This man sexually assaulted babies of 18 months and children under 5 years old. (Liked to pick them young so they couldn't tell, it seems) If society doesn't consider that a hideous crime then what is? <BR/><BR/>Please don't give me any pseudo-highminded claptrap about the World situation. If someone assaulted my child I wouldn't feel high-minded and I would certainly be more than "mildly irritated". I would want the offender to pay for what he did - because if he doesn't, what protection is there for anyone.<BR/><BR/>Paedophilia is NOT a lifestyle choice, it is a disgusting abhorrant crime against innocent children.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1415870551956361452007-08-24T13:03:00.000+01:002007-08-24T13:03:00.000+01:00I too found the judge's decision more than a littl...I too found the judge's decision more than a little odd.<BR/><BR/>Last week Ch 4 showed a docudrama about a paedophile who underwent treatment, following imprisonment, and the message was in his case it worked. The programme ended, and it emerged that he had not re-offended in 2 years. I would have liked to have seen a longer test period before claiming a success. Because, I too, have my doubts about the effectiveness of such treatment programmes.jailhouselawyerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03795278184797990706noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-43527391845295942672007-08-24T13:01:00.001+01:002007-08-24T13:01:00.001+01:00Just read more of your posts weaselyou are not the...Just read more of your posts weasel<BR/>you are not the only one to have been fondled by a pervy school teacher , its happened to me and no doubt others here.<BR/>well heres a shock you were at school a place full of children so where are you likely to find paedos? just as lions hang around wildebeeste so child molestors hang around children.<BR/>As you know I am fairly conservative, but to equate homosexuality with paedophillia is just as wrong as saying that all heterosexual men fancy little girls. Gay men are attracted to masculinity and to be blunt, cock. Well thats the opinion I have formed anyway .Some paedophiles are homosexual in just the way some are heterosexual.<BR/>Sorry to attack you , I normaly enjoy your posts.The Hitchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17007793676288933155noreply@blogger.com