tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post8727390959358086500..comments2024-03-04T17:54:32.559+00:00Comments on Iain Dale's Diary: Why I Published Peter Watt: A Reply to Sunder KatwalaIain Dalehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comBlogger23125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-34651192039434772622010-01-11T09:11:18.827+00:002010-01-11T09:11:18.827+00:00This comment has been removed by the author.Unsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-38934753661734832672010-01-11T09:11:06.068+00:002010-01-11T09:11:06.068+00:00@ Newmania
"at least admit the possibility t...@ Newmania<br /><br />"at least admit the possibility that getting paid for something does not mean you are lying"<br /><br />Precisely. Otherwise all of those paid 'witnesses' (e.g. 'climate experts') who pronounce in favour of Labour policies are equally discredited. Sunder Katwala is dissembling. It is a diversionary tactic designed specifically to avoid direct response to the matters raised in Watt's book. <br /><br />I would be altogether more impressed if Katwala had the ability to address those matters, but his current 'observations' hardly merit attention - except that they graphically confirm what we all know of the Left, the desperation to close debate and scrutiny by attacking the messenger. In short, his position is intellectually untenable.<br /><br />When people like the execrable Liam Byrne say to 'interviewers' that Watt 'has a book to sell' they should immediately be challenged to confirm that Watt is lying. The choice is simple, either Watt is factually correct or the book is a tissue of lies. The remedies are in the courts. Is Byrne prepared to take his chances?Unsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-74756164185065162252010-01-11T02:27:14.733+00:002010-01-11T02:27:14.733+00:00Sunder if you are going to get sniffy about "...Sunder if you are going to get sniffy about "financial gain" , should you not tell us what you are paid by the Fabian society and to what extent your continued employment depends on your broadly proselytising on behalf of Labour ? I took it that that was your job <br /><br />To what extent does that compromise your position ? I doubt the question arises in practice but you should, at least admit the possibility that getting paid for something does not mean you are lying .I speak as a clean limbed Corinthian gentleman addressing a “Player “Newmaniahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11922161971821380803noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-72509418993177434342010-01-10T23:56:19.644+00:002010-01-10T23:56:19.644+00:00Sunder,
You are merely confirming exactly as I sa...Sunder,<br /><br />You are merely confirming exactly as I said: you believe that no-one should publish anyone which might shed light into the internal workings of the Labour Party.<br /><br />You also use the concept of "financial gain" as an insult to belittle and demean an author and to establish some imagined moral superiority on your part.<br /><br />You are, in other words, acting largely as one would expect a privileged and unashamedly partisan apologist for the Labour Party to behave when faced with hard evidence not only of his party's political failings but of the utter vacuum that exists at the ideological and moral heart of the Labour Party, the Labour leadership and the Labour membership.<br /><br />As I said, your bitterness, your desperation and your petty denigration of any perspective that deviates from the party line is unattractive in the extreme.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14210245445771564283noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-18022926409351596762010-01-10T23:02:40.310+00:002010-01-10T23:02:40.310+00:00Iain,
Sorry, but your position appears to combin...Iain, <br /><br />Sorry, but your position appears to combine the following points:<br /><br />* declaring that something is the most important news story of the weekend of January 10th;<br /><br />* embargoing review or media copies until January 25th; <br /><br />* challenging anybody other than the author, publisher or Mail on Sunday who wishes to comment on said story of a "rush to judgement" for not having read the embargoed book.<br /><br />This is somewhat illogical, though <br />uncharacteristically, if I may say so!<br /><br />Clearly, it is valid to make at least a provisional judgement on the basis of the serialisation which forms the news and political intervention. <br /><br />Nobody could think Peter Watt too naive to understand the politics of it, as you must accept even if you took an enormously low view of his talents or motives <a href="http://iaindale.blogspot.com/2007/11/45-words-that-shame-labour-party.html" rel="nofollow">in declaring him "either a liar or an incompetent fool</a>" in November 2007.<br /><br />Or was that, in hindsight, a rush to judgement?!Sunder Katwalahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06671411534003530927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-61298579817489670082010-01-10T22:55:51.417+00:002010-01-10T22:55:51.417+00:00I'd be very happy to publish a similar book fr...<i>I'd be very happy to publish a similar book from a Conservative if I thought it would make a profit</i><br /><br /><br />Is that really true ? <br />Thats a bit like saying if someone gave me some money I would campaign for the Labour Party. I probably need the cash more than you but I simply could not bring myself to do attack everyhting I believe , for money .<br /><br />Well ok ...how much :)Newmaniahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11922161971821380803noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-7684396822997056292010-01-10T22:43:14.602+00:002010-01-10T22:43:14.602+00:00Yes, Sunder, and I believe the Pope tends towards ...Yes, Sunder, and I believe the Pope tends towards the Catholic faith.<br /><br />They would have said that whenever the book came out. What they might want to do - and you too - is actually read the book as a whole before rushing to judgement like you already have. Uncharacteristaically, if I may say so.Iain Dalehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-48695081083672547052010-01-10T22:40:18.583+00:002010-01-10T22:40:18.583+00:00Good grief.
Sunde4r could have saved a lot of tim...Good grief.<br /><br />Sunde4r could have saved a lot of time by writing: "Iain, I am bit jealous. Good luck with the book."<br /><br />I only wish I could write a book. Too many years spent writing copy to fit 250 to 1,000 word stories has blunted any aspirations along those lines. Still, I can dream!Martin Shttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04148241391183658112noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-13159252474326219922010-01-10T22:31:45.598+00:002010-01-10T22:31:45.598+00:00Q
Of course I can't criticise Iain Dale for p...Q<br /><br />Of course I can't criticise Iain Dale for publishing the book. (My post says "one can hardly fairly criticise Iain Dale for any of this. It is good news for his publishing business, for his media profile and for his political prospects"). Nor indeed Isabel Oakeshott for co-authoring it. <br /><br />That is what publishers and journalists should do. <br /><br />What I wrote was that Labour party members will question the decision of a former party General Secretary/Chair/senior figure, etc to produce something in this type of "score settling" tone of today's extract in the first week of an election year, and publish and serialise it in a way which everyone can see is designed to maximise its political impact and damage.Sunder Katwalahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06671411534003530927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-36866729416666166972010-01-10T21:18:34.693+00:002010-01-10T21:18:34.693+00:00"Peter feels a deep loyalty to the Labour Par..."Peter feels a deep loyalty to the Labour Party"<br /><br />Well that's nice. Just imagine what he might have done if he didn't.Jimmyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01542633492362670045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-58892455623957017782010-01-10T21:06:56.319+00:002010-01-10T21:06:56.319+00:00Comprehensive and straightforward response - are y...Comprehensive and straightforward response - are you sure you want to become a MP?<br /><br />Thought I had missed the BBC coverage - they are biased (and their complainst procedure useless)ferial ferrethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15331022139318686428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-75401387767410725212010-01-10T21:04:06.438+00:002010-01-10T21:04:06.438+00:00Basically, Sunder is saying that you should never ...Basically, Sunder is saying that you should never publish anything, in any circumstances, that might be seen as remotely critical of the Labour Party. He is also saying that the only motives anyone can have for writing a non-academic monograph are personal revenge, egotism or the pursuit of financial gain - and financial gain, obviously, is as wicked as either narcissism or vengefulness.<br /><br />I don't know that this post has really shown me a huge insight into the publishing of Watt's book, but it has given me an insight into Katwala's mindset and attitude and I can tell you it is not a pretty sight.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14210245445771564283noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-29103077575145389852010-01-10T20:48:06.334+00:002010-01-10T20:48:06.334+00:00I read the extracts today in the Mail on Sunday an...I read the extracts today in the Mail on Sunday and I found them fascinating. Very glad that you published the book Ian.<br /><br />The thing that astonishes me is the lack of honesty by Gordon Brown about the election that never was in 2007. He has maintained that that he did not intend to call an election and it was all put up by the media.<br /><br />Perhaps David Cameron can ask him about this in the TV debates during the election.Sungei Patanihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17059092510150451922noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-59334159112855778972010-01-10T20:15:08.146+00:002010-01-10T20:15:08.146+00:00Interesting though the machinations and calculatio...Interesting though the machinations and calculations around publishing may be, I'd query why Katwala is so pruriently interested in your finances and why he deliberately impugns Watts motivations. But perhaps he does believe that is the real story.<br /><br />I think this is typical of the Left - the constant reduction of political discussion to personal smear, the deliberate avoidance of the serious matters raised. It is a great pity that people like Sunder Katwala expend so much effort in attributing such motivations to others. They are, of course, judging people by their own notably base standards.Unsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-25191888852009127242010-01-10T19:06:09.134+00:002010-01-10T19:06:09.134+00:00@Stevenradams aka weird codename @6:30
I agree e...@Stevenradams aka weird codename @6:30<br /><br /> I agree entirely. The BBC News Channel has decided to run with two political stories from the Sunday papers on their banner and the BBCi 'Main Headlines':<br /><br /> Story 1:<br /><br /> Gordon's interview.<br /><br /> Story 2:<br /><br /> The Goldsmiths in the Times.<br /><br /> Hahahahaha. Weeers the other storee BeebeeSee??<br /> Where is it? Where?<br /><br /> Talk about counterfactuals!Conandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18028671462205997161noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-5622847606553920112010-01-10T19:00:05.399+00:002010-01-10T19:00:05.399+00:00Nice post.
You are at your best like this. Polite...Nice post.<br /><br />You are at your best like this. Polite, calm, reasoned and right.OldSlaughterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04807170326475262427noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-44318933351382732362010-01-10T18:45:07.775+00:002010-01-10T18:45:07.775+00:00I like the look of the "The Prime Ministers W...I like the look of the "The Prime Ministers Who Never Were" counterfactuals book but do we really have to wait another 16 months for it?<br /><br />Tell Francis to get a wriggle on!Mark Thompsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00744387583593537268noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-64717579584340561232010-01-10T18:40:44.059+00:002010-01-10T18:40:44.059+00:00Having been involved in legal education and publis...Having been involved in legal education and publishing for 25+ years in my past - I know exactly what you mean by risk and the ability of the bookshops to exert downward pressure on margins. <br /><br />Publishing is a hard business. Full credit to you for taking it on. As you state quite clearly - your publishing is commercial.<br /><br />I shall buy the book. I am interested in political biographies.<br /><br />I think it is important to have publishers who are prepared to take on risks. If Watt and your company make a reasonable return on this book - excellent, but I accept Watt may not have been motivated by money.<br /><br />I have voted Labour since the mid-seventies. I am a 'critical' supporter. The government record on civil rights and human rights has not been brilliant. By the same token the Tory record wasn't brilliant either - so no point scoring there. Mr Watt's revelations, thus far, make rather depressing reading for labour supporters. I like understatement. <br /><br />The good writers in the press, political bloggers of all persuasions add colour and interest to politics for those of us who are interested in politics. The range of political opinion expressed in blogs alone is truly fantastic - and long may that continue.<br /><br />AS apricotfox said... Good on you and Peter Watt for bringing an important story out. If labour can't handle it - that is their problem.<br /><br />It will be interesting to see if they dismiss it as just another 'bit of silliness'. From the extract /excerpt today. I think they would be foolish to do so. <br /><br />Loyalty goes both ways and it would appear that Mr Watt was hung out to dry - which I find rather distasteful.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-32526988031954507292010-01-10T18:34:26.499+00:002010-01-10T18:34:26.499+00:00It really burns me up when the talking heads preac...It really burns me up when the talking heads preach about a book they have not read by an author and ghost whom they have no interviewed. Orders from the Bunker or messaged by flying NokiaEan Craigiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12953207008957782090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-60947434976221125922010-01-10T18:30:08.426+00:002010-01-10T18:30:08.426+00:00Hear, hear. A good story to tell and publish – I h...Hear, hear. A good story to tell and publish – I hope that the sales do the decision justice. I'm just stunned that the BBC has felt justified in so roundly ignoring/rubbishing the story.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-42656069429214075082010-01-10T18:28:23.289+00:002010-01-10T18:28:23.289+00:00I'm ordering a copy. Can't wait.I'm ordering a copy. Can't wait.Birdhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12161658443183028628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-80475957409914550172010-01-10T18:13:46.373+00:002010-01-10T18:13:46.373+00:00well, that's a full reply, thanks. (Even if yo...well, that's a full reply, thanks. (Even if you gave the pre-orders, not the print run).<br /><br />Trade publishers are a bit wary of political memoir. You mention the heavily promoted, and highly newsworthy, Currie diaries selling about 6000 or so, which would make 8000 for Peter Watt quite an achievement if you don't get most of them back. (I think Norman Fowler's scintillating memoirs sold about 3000). I don't know how many ministerial or other insider memoirs we will actually see in future. Clearly, there <br /><br />As it happens, I did publish some general/trade politics, including people like John Redwood, the Nuffield election study and so on, though this was the pre-Amazon era.Sunder Katwalahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06671411534003530927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-81350341731708806212010-01-10T18:11:47.290+00:002010-01-10T18:11:47.290+00:00Good on you, Iain. Looking forward to reading it.Good on you, Iain. Looking forward to reading it.apricotfoxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05487439964729651505noreply@blogger.com