tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post7183529349052602588..comments2024-03-04T17:54:32.559+00:00Comments on Iain Dale's Diary: Students: Uncover Their FacesIain Dalehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comBlogger104125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-27599265480723447382010-12-14T11:39:56.857+00:002010-12-14T11:39:56.857+00:00@allnottinghambasearebelongtous
Its rich for you ...@allnottinghambasearebelongtous<br /><br />Its rich for you to call people an idiot when your acting like one who thinks the police won't fight back. The police are not the government they are the public sector law enFORCEment. Don't bore us with your wet lefty spin because its exactly the kind of irresponsible attitude that holds no place in the real world. If the protesters have more injuries its only because they are picking a fight they will never win. You need a reality check seriously. <br /><br />If you want to live in a country where the police can't get the upper hand on a mob of idiots then go else where.Phil101https://www.blogger.com/profile/08754208650673209044noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-44883755999583713012010-12-14T02:17:15.741+00:002010-12-14T02:17:15.741+00:00Nobody dragged a policeman off a horse you idiot, ...Nobody dragged a policeman off a horse you idiot, he lost control and fell off by himself.<br /><br />The horse was probably spooked by a copper beating two women over the head directly in front of it.<br /><br />As for the violence the overwhelming majority was caused by the police, as demonstrated by the disproportionately higher injuries among protesters and worse injuries.<br /><br />As for police attempting to kettle the protesters from the start, dragging a disabled person from his wheelchair and dragging him across the road, pressuring hospital staff not to accept a protester (Alfie Meadows who had a life threatening brain injury), not to mention masses of footage of police beating protesters, rather proves that it was the police who went in with the intention of violence and thuggery.<br /><br />The most generous assessment of police conduct is that they made no attempt to distinguish between those who they claimed were initiating violence and those who were, say forced forwards by the crowd or even merely standing around.<br /><br />Still the police can rely on people like you and David Cameron peddling the lie about a policeman being pulled off a horse. Rather says it all that the only footage the police apologists can find doesn't show what they claim it does.Andyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03710776765139258627noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-73836790527237924382010-12-12T21:10:00.036+00:002010-12-12T21:10:00.036+00:00I did some research on the organisations behind th...I did some research on the organisations behind the "student protests" , just out of interest. <br /> <br />Some of he results were scary, some tragic and some quite comic - so I posted them on the Graun CIF thread. <br /> <br />I'm taking the liberty of cross posting here because I think people might be interested:- <br /> <br />In deciding who was responsible for the violence, it's instructive to look at the origins of the organising body "National Campaign Against Cuts & Fees". <br /> <br />A recent Guardian piece :- <br /> <br />http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2010/dec/10/tuition-fees-student-demonstrators <br /> <br />said of them:- <br />The National Campaign against Fees and Cuts (NCAFC) was formed on 6 February this year after a conference in London of 170 university students who were engaged in activism on their campuses. "At that point anti-cuts movements hadn't really been founded because it was before the election," said Simon Hardy, 21, a student at the University of Westminster and a prominent figure within Ncafc. <br />What the Guardian coyly didn't say however (although the poster in the photo gives a clue) is that Simon has long been a prime mover in an altogether less cuddly organisation called "Revolution Socialist Youth Movement" <br /> <br />http://www.socialistrevolution.org/ <br /> <br />Which states its aims as:- <br />We want to bring down Cam and Clegg's millionaire coalition and replace it with socialism. The rich and powerful clique responsible for breaking up our public services, slashing benefits and leaving millions of us on the dole will not give up their wealth and property by being voted out. They are launching a class war to make youth and workers pay the cost of capitalism's crisis. We want to seize their assets and abolish class society with a socialist revolution. <br />Another prime mover in NAAFC is the head of Revolution Socialst Youth Movement - one John Bowman. <br /> <br />http://suacs.wordpress.com/2010/11/14/save-our-services-in-surrey-students-3/ <br />John Bowman, a member of Workers Power and Revolution Socialist Youth, has been a leading member of the Campaign Against Fees and Cuts, the main organisers of the 10th November student protest. Workers Power and Revolution Socialist Youth have been in the forefront of the recent student movement. <br />John's main organisation is "Workers Power" <br /> <br /> <br />http://www.workerspower.com/ <br /> <br />and describes itself thus:- <br />Workers Power is a revolutionary communist organisation. We fight to: <br />• Abolish capitalism and create a world without exploitation, class divisions and oppression <br />• Break the resistance of the exploiters by the force of millions acting together in a social revolution smashing the repressive capitalist state <br />and announces proudly that it is part of the "5th Communist World International" <br /> <br />http://www.fifthinternational.org/ <br /> <br />Is John a student or a full time international communist agitator - who knows? <br /> <br />I think all the dewy eyed Mums 'n Dads who sent their little darlings off to protest should realise they were simply pawns in premeditated, organised violence by the usual anti-capitalist / anti-globalisation / anti-government/ anti-police anti-anything but a good punch up mob.Foxgoosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09187713758083902994noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-79065472603551399432010-12-12T16:16:35.275+00:002010-12-12T16:16:35.275+00:00@ Despairing Liberal
Define 'student'. O...@ Despairing Liberal<br /><br />Define 'student'. Oh and this might help: <br /><br />http://tiny.cc/j61inUnsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-75221583635236268802010-12-12T14:22:07.782+00:002010-12-12T14:22:07.782+00:00You make some good points as always longrun2 - it ...You make some good points as always longrun2 - it is obviously true that those who are born to privelege should behave respectfully to others and in a way that lives up to it and that is associated with traditional Toryism, a set of views I have far more sympathy for than you might think. My point is that these traditional Tory views have essentially decayed and the modern replacement is hard-boiled superiority and exclusionism by the wealthy, of which young Gilmour's antics are but a typical symptom. The entrenched privilege of Oxbridge entry for the children of the rich is still there (would Charlie with his glaring stupidity really have made it in to Girton without a great deal of financial assistance along the way and a Cambridge Uni family background?) but not the noblesse oblige. The Tory press and some of you here seem to know that - hence all the fuss - but not to acknowledge that the collapse of traditional values is near-total and the Toryism you now support is simply aimed at maintaining the power of the bankers, the hedge funders, the super-wealthy, etc. We live in a genuine moral vacuam as regards class structure now. We are not in Downton Abbey, more like, as the Eye puts it so well, Downturn Abbey.<br /><br />On a more up to the minute story, can anyone with half a brain now seriously claim that it was "students" who held up the royal car now that <a href="http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1337884/Did-suspects-attack-Camilla-tuition-fees-riots-Police-issue-rogues-gallery-14-protesters.html" rel="nofollow">the photos</a> are out? Clearly this is an urban street gang running amok, more Hackney Marshes than Dreaming Spires.DespairingLiberalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02903904463236135611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-53506765903969161362010-12-12T09:02:09.744+00:002010-12-12T09:02:09.744+00:00"The demonstrators need to be better organise...<i>"The demonstrators need to be better organised. A determined effort for example to keep the media away from the unpleasant element would be a start..."</i><br /><br />You think the press should be prevented from doing their job because it's showing left-wing rabble in a poor light?!? Extraordinary, even from you.JuliaMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07844126589712842477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-27699107090160983132010-12-12T00:57:30.057+00:002010-12-12T00:57:30.057+00:00@Joe Public
It is a cheap spin, what your on abo...@Joe Public <br /><br />It is a cheap spin, what your on about has nothing to do with Ian dales suggestion. You seem to be pulling the race card out of no where.Phil101https://www.blogger.com/profile/08754208650673209044noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-11338108946841221362010-12-11T23:02:01.751+00:002010-12-11T23:02:01.751+00:00@ DespairingLiberal
Has someone hacked into your a...@ DespairingLiberal<br />Has someone hacked into your account? You are usually a sensible dissenting opinion, which is valuable lest Iain say something outrageously silly.<br />(i) lots of students got assaulted by the police for doing nothing - so the police had nothing better to do? Pull the other leg!<br />(ii) An MI5 stunt would have hit Charles not Camilla, less pain, better headlines<br />(iii) He (not she) looks to be dressed more expensively than me, and I admit to being middle-class<br />(iv) "Some of you seem to be knocking David Gilmour's son because his father is rich. I thought you were tories, in which case, isn't it actually fine for him to (a) have a rich father and (b) behave as he wants? After all, the whole point of Toryism is to entrench pre-existing privilege and what greater privelege is there than to be above the law?"<br />NO NO NO - Tories belive that the rich have responsibilities. Laissez faire is the province of Liberals<br />PLEASE learn some history, read some of Disraeli's novels, learn how to spell privilege, and THINK<br />(v) again think the Met Police spokeswoman was told that the protesters were students - why blame her for using that term - what do you think the reaction would have been from Will Straw, Grauniad etc if she had described the trouble-makers as SWP without total,CCTV coverage to support that? <br /><br />(vi) "As for rich, spoiled kids in general - if some of them have decided to take an interest in the prospects of their less well-off fellow students, what's wrong with that?" There is nothing wrong with taking an interest. My sons, who may just possibly* be spoiled but are not rich (because I am not) has lobbied peacefully (including ranting at me when I wanted to go to bed) against the introduction/rise in tuition fees but avoided any violence<br /><br /><br /><br />*but the three of us don't think soAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-32972584307723059392010-12-11T22:28:00.385+00:002010-12-11T22:28:00.385+00:00@Tory boys...
What a pillock you are. Red Ed'...@Tory boys...<br /><br />What a pillock you are. Red Ed's crony Aaron Poster should get the cleaning bill and the parents of those arrasted should be hit those bills too. As for the imbicile who urinated on Winston Churchill's statue, if he had done that say in China, he would have been reduced into an eunach and shipped to Saudi harem. As for that Pink Floyd swinging monkey, give him 100 days of cleaning the stables of police horses. I would use water cannon quirte early on to drench these thugs so that they stand shivering in the cold. As for that lad who had the brain surgery, we should be asking the surgeons which part of the body they found the brain.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-63925875552307004662010-12-11T22:07:31.102+00:002010-12-11T22:07:31.102+00:00@ Julia M
I can't trace what you're quoti...@ Julia M <br />I can't trace what you're quoting but the answer is 'last time my club had a "home" cross-country match' when I helped to set out the course and then "marshalled" i.e stood at a place where the runners in each of the six races had to turn a corner and showed them which way to go, and afterwards helped to take down the course markers after the last race. Bit more exposed than central London. The next occasion is next week. Oh, our Club Secretary, who is older than I, does all* this and runs in the Senior Men's race as well.<br />*except marshalling his own race before any pedant points this outAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-23631626544277594312010-12-11T21:55:02.415+00:002010-12-11T21:55:02.415+00:00"...police officers being dragged off police ...<i>"...police officers being dragged off police horses and beaten, it is not acceptable."</i><br />David Cameron<br /><br /><br /><i>"...pulls a policewoman off a horse..."</i><br />Iain Dale<br /><br />Oh really? When was that?<br /><br />Here's the video footage.<br /><br />The policewoman falls off her own horse.<br /><br />The policewoman is not beaten.<br /><br />http://liberalconspiracy.org/2010/12/11/were-police-really-dragged-off-horses-and-beaten-by-students-no/Richard SMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15417150047883519380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-42077348421377012972010-12-11T20:57:10.940+00:002010-12-11T20:57:10.940+00:00@ Phil101 6:23
Nothing to do with a 'cheap li...@ Phil101 6:23<br /><br />Nothing to do with a 'cheap little spin' as you put it.<br /><br />If citizens with 'covered faces' are to have certain sanctions applied, fine. But don't then discriminate.Joe Publichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07829909061904690380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-17439232484906551132010-12-11T18:23:25.129+00:002010-12-11T18:23:25.129+00:00@Joe Public
Keep on subject Ian's suggestion ...@Joe Public<br /><br />Keep on subject Ian's suggestion has nothing to do with the Burka. I recommend you read it properly next time before trying that cheap little spin.Phil101https://www.blogger.com/profile/08754208650673209044noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-796835194619515812010-12-11T17:02:46.568+00:002010-12-11T17:02:46.568+00:00Perhaps the Cenotaph needs a more appropriate ins...Perhaps the Cenotaph needs <a href="http://lakelandersview.blogspot.com/2010/12/we-dont-need-no-education.html" rel="nofollow"> a more appropriate inscription?</a>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-45870365886545602862010-12-11T16:41:14.024+00:002010-12-11T16:41:14.024+00:00@ Phil101
Well said. You're probably right a...@ Phil101<br /><br />Well said. You're probably right about the nature of these rioters but what concerns me is the attitudes commonly displayed by the parasitical lecturers and teachers, many of whom seem to actively encourage such behaviour. <br /><br />They, too, must bear responsibility for their charges - those who have been entrusted to their care for learning. Seems to me that some of these tutors are in the business of Marxist political indoctrination. One might argue that this is a form of grooming, but whatever it may be, it is a very long way indeed from honourable academic integrity.Unsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-22194735926431920632010-12-11T16:10:52.663+00:002010-12-11T16:10:52.663+00:00On the last page of the Wealth of Nations Adam Smi...On the last page of the Wealth of Nations Adam Smith warns against "protected interests". All policy from this and the last govt, and from the BoE, has had one purpose, to maintain bubble house prices.<br />The result is unemployment, de-industrialisation, govt deficit, 1/5 of potential owner occupier households unable to form, a dearth of safe reliable MBS, and student debt accelerating to a level unsustainable at current tax and real house price levels.<br />The students are right. Govt policy is wrong.<br />As disclosure I'm a middle aged professional, a successful equity trader, a homeowner, a tory voter and entrepreneur.<br />I agree with addressing the deficit, but savings are one side of the coin. The other side is facilitating new business'. There is no realistic policy to address the barriers and costs for business created by existing legislation. We can't save our way out of this deficit, we have to work our way out of it. We need to take the legislative shackles off business. We need the chance to dig our selves out of this mess.the crooked briefhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14685328136221610369noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-42270839681656732592010-12-11T15:27:48.660+00:002010-12-11T15:27:48.660+00:00I can't believe I am typing this. (Yes, just c...I can't believe I am typing this. (Yes, just checked, it IS me!) but I feel that the time is coming when armed police will have to patrol these riots, when water cannons and other non-lethal methods of control will have to be introduced.<br /><br />Any any lecturer who encourages their students to attend these riots should be sacked for gross misconduct.Matthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17774822085901274565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-55699077581891524222010-12-11T14:16:52.561+00:002010-12-11T14:16:52.561+00:00In general, the police are far from angelic, as th...In general, the police are far from angelic, as the Countryside Alliance can testify. Having said that, are they supposed to stand there and just take it?<br /><br />I am not a big fan of peaceful protest simply because it can so easily turn to King Mob. I fail to see why the student case cannot be made through political parties, through the media and through personal debate.<br /><br />Yesterday may yet turn out to have had one tragic consequence, and could have had more. Royal protection officers were close,we are told, to drawing weapons. In those circumstances, once drawn, they are likely to be fired.<br /><br />My worry is that the hard left scents blood and that is dangerous.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11995535454830660589noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-83627529982999700962010-12-11T14:13:01.475+00:002010-12-11T14:13:01.475+00:00This comment has been removed by the author.Joe Publichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07829909061904690380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-16277676985217424302010-12-11T14:12:04.332+00:002010-12-11T14:12:04.332+00:00"....the Police should make clear that anyone..."....the Police should make clear that anyone covering their face with a mask...."<br /><br />What? & discriminate against certain female Muslims?? That's not very PC, is it, Mr Dale.Joe Publichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07829909061904690380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-5734088062561089932010-12-11T14:08:41.539+00:002010-12-11T14:08:41.539+00:00Aaron Porter NUS President graduated in 2006! He&#...Aaron Porter NUS President graduated in 2006! He's spent 4 yrs on sabbatical! Wonder if he's started paying off his student loan like me?Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02182494901043757399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1415594012618347652010-12-11T13:44:22.288+00:002010-12-11T13:44:22.288+00:00I was at home that day and after switching on the ...I was at home that day and after switching on the news for what I thought would be a brief update ended up watching it for several hours. From what I saw on various channels the police, in general, had to put up with massive provocation. One guy in particular was using what looked like a piece of scaffolding (or perhaps a metal bar from fencing) like a lance against the police lines. <br /> <br />I liked this piece from another blog -<br />"Recent events remind me of California in the days when Ronald Reagan first ran for office in the late 1960s determined to stop the endless student riots in UC Berkeley. He said, "Higher education is a privilege and not a right so these hoodlums should be thrown out. They are spoiled brats who do not deserve to be at a great state university." Nobody much cared when the ineffectual principal was fired but he got their attention when he proposed slashing the university budget and upping student fees to compensate. When mayhem once again broke out on campus he sent in the National Guard who arrested over a thousand rioters most of whom landed up in the Santa Rita jail. Around the same time at Cambridge University, Mr Justice Melford Stevenson sent rioting students to Borstal for three years. If 21st century students are resorting to the street violence of the 1960s perhaps we need some of that era's policing and sentencing."Jockdownsouthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05754646277549520656noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-75521106248440967502010-12-11T13:35:19.952+00:002010-12-11T13:35:19.952+00:00"Requiring demonstrators to remove face cover..."Requiring demonstrators to remove face coverings is a non-starter...because it would pose a serious problem for the police...making it...difficult...for their Agent provocateurs ...deliberately provoking violence...staging the odd bit of spectacular criminal damage for the cameras"<br /><br />Yes, revolutionary socialists going on a wrecking spree is shockingly out of character, so it must be policemen dressed up as anarchists who were waving banners saying they want to end capitalism and bring down the government. I see your logic. <br /><br />As for your boast about having half a brain, I suggest that pea brained is more accurate. Try focusing the massive cognitive capacity of your pea brain on an answer to your own question. Who benefits from a collapse in law and order and the truimph of mob rule? You think about that for as long as it takes and come back when you have an answer.wildhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14437167510102273197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-48197565587735239732010-12-11T12:55:17.024+00:002010-12-11T12:55:17.024+00:00"Of course most of us predicted that the Tori..."Of course most of us predicted that the Tories brief and rather rather unconvincing flirtation with civil liberties"<br /><br />A free society (which is liberty sustained by the disciplines of tolerance and truth seeking) is precisely what the Left is against, hence their fondness for lies, intimidation, and the revolutionary violence of crowds. <br /><br />You fantasize about a world without "cops" because the world is an affront to your narcissism.<br /><br />All you have is your hated. I bet you do not know the slightest thing about the debate how to fund universities, not even the tiniest amount of knowledge. What a complete waste of existence you are Jimmy.wildhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14437167510102273197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-5746604088303787362010-12-11T12:39:12.594+00:002010-12-11T12:39:12.594+00:00@ Euan
"you can only arrest people if you ha...@ Euan<br /><br />"you can only arrest people if you have evidence of wrongdoing."<br /><br />You're an idiot. Suspicion is adequate legal justification.<br /><br />Are you studying before the Bar?Unsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.com