tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post537245388169966846..comments2024-03-04T17:54:32.559+00:00Comments on Iain Dale's Diary: Personal Attacks on Clegg Are MisguidedIain Dalehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comBlogger52125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-36611524168028171412010-04-19T10:52:23.423+01:002010-04-19T10:52:23.423+01:00Ian:
You're right, but didn't go far enou...Ian:<br /><br />You're right, but didn't go far enough. We're being told ad nauseum that a hung Parliament is nigh on inevitable and neither major party can govern without LibDem support.<br /><br />Well, it's time for the media and public to demand Clegg walk the talk about his new politics of transparency and honesty.<br /><br />Mr Clegg, please tell the British people what would be your absolute bottom lines to support either a Labour or Conservative-minority government. No fudge, no waffle, and no deal cut after the election in Westminster backrooms. <br /><br />Then we can ask Brown and Cameron if they're willing to accept your terms.Craig Ranapiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08923246310584658857noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-56028336214584426322010-04-19T10:38:11.616+01:002010-04-19T10:38:11.616+01:00Iain. Personal attacks of this nature do not work ...Iain. Personal attacks of this nature do not work and should be avoided. The comments you highlight border on racism - which is pretty poor form to be honest. <br /><br />But that doesn't mean that criticism and examination of the Lib Dems should only be confined to Lib Dem policy.<br /><br />Nick Clegg should be scrutinised. He is afterall a professional politician (despite his protestations to the contrary), and has had a spell as an MEP (Europe is his weak link and if people knew what a committed Europhile he really is, they might not be so keen on him). <br /><br />He has never had a proper job, comes from a background equally as privileged as Cameron's, and advocates some very dangerous things (like membership of the euro).<br /><br />So, I do think it is legitimate to question his judgement and suitability.<br /><br />You can (and in this case should) legitimately scrutinise and examine someone without resorting to gutter politics.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02485189761817023749noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-41084520711693701352010-04-19T10:29:19.954+01:002010-04-19T10:29:19.954+01:00It does make you wonder where his priorities and l...It does make you wonder where his priorities and loyalties will lie though. If "cast iron" Dave can stitch us up over the EU, what hope is there with Clegg? Or do you think we should just roll-over, be run by Brussels and pay £bns for the privilege?Goodwinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16622335283524262832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-34301858943676892782010-04-19T09:38:51.326+01:002010-04-19T09:38:51.326+01:00So far I know in my neighbourhood the women are dr...So far I know in my neighbourhood the women are drooling over Clegg! They must be the ones who bumped up the poll ratings to 33% for a man who did nothing but to stand I said , Labour and Conservatives are the same. Read his manifesto, it will be shock and these women my in neighbourhood were the very same who voted for Blair-the same reason of attractive young man. Seems a fullMonty effect! Incidentally all these women do not want EU but want Clegg!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-15221207710038209882010-04-19T06:29:43.954+01:002010-04-19T06:29:43.954+01:00'Mail has objectionable headline'
Well kn...'Mail has objectionable headline'<br /><br />Well knock me down with a feather. <br /><br />I can't disagree with your comment though: personal attacks on the (by all accounts) personable won't get far.<br /><br />Much better to point out, for example, that when he gained praise for his 'immigration chaos' remark, that his party's stance has been historically supportive of Labour's mass immigration policy: it's just the chaos they object to. <br /><br />More specifically, the Lib Dems have always criticised Labour's inability to process <i>efficiently</i> all the applications for passports, asylum, indefinite leave to remain etc. It's not the numbers they mind, rather that the applications should just have been approved more swiftly.<br /><br />They also single out the failure to <i>plan</i> for such numbers, never considering whether the policy itself could ultimately take more from Britain than it gives.<br /><br />There is a recent commitment to a reduction in numbers by about a quarter, but I'm afraid it only appeared in the run up to the election, no doubt after looking at the issues that really appear ro concern the public. The Lib Dem's heart has certainly isn't in it.Dave Hhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02330412326038302877noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-57098077609886751132010-04-18T23:18:06.618+01:002010-04-18T23:18:06.618+01:00You are right to take down the post. The reality ...You are right to take down the post. The reality remains a referndum on in/out. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/election-2010/7603945/Nick-Clegg-defends-Liberal-Democrat-stance-on-Europe.html<br /><br />You are, however, wrong to say that Clegg is a nice guy. This referendum issue shows a cynical politician. Whenever he gets a chance he will present the British people with a false choice: sign up, or get out. He wishes to polarise the debate. He conspired with Brown to deny the British people a say on the constitution, but wishes to snooker them into endorsing even greater integration.<br /><br />It is wrong to bring in his parentage. But, like many British politicians, his true patriotism is aimed at the EU. He will use every underhand trick to advance that cause. And while doing so, he will pretend to being open and honest.<br /><br />Nice guy, that Mr Clegg:<br /><br />----------------<br /><br />PS: If you want to know Mandelson's play on the Icelandic volcano. It is wonderfully subtle.<br /><br />The hero will not be Brown, it will be the EU. So, come the debate on Thursday, lots of pro-EU points to spike Cameron's guns.<br /><br />http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/apr/18/peter-mandelson-iceland-volcano-navy<br /><br />--------------<br /><br />http://joseph1832-thinkingconservatism.blogspot.com/Joseph1832https://www.blogger.com/profile/08179622074968176477noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-37198927052908349952010-04-18T23:04:22.626+01:002010-04-18T23:04:22.626+01:00I presume the Lib Dems will uphold this referendum...I presume the Lib Dems will uphold this referendum promise with the same commitment they upheld the Lisbon Treaty one.<br /><br />Strange that no-one told Ming Campbell though:<br /><br /><i>The Lib Dems have ended their campaign for an "in or out" referendum on UK membership of the European Union.<br /><br />The pro-European party had argued that instead of a vote on the Lisbon Treaty a referendum was needed on Britain's broader relationship with the EU.<br /><br />But ex-leader Sir Menzies Campbell said there was no "public appetite" for a vote now that the treaty was ratified.</i><br /><br />http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8388475.stm<br /><br />They really are a joke partyTheBoilingFroghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00791961503315586243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-4747560242751634622010-04-18T21:59:23.802+01:002010-04-18T21:59:23.802+01:00Agree that personal attacks are both wrong and unl...Agree that personal attacks are both wrong and unlikely to win support. Sadly, I fear that CCHQ halfwits will be urging DC to undermine Clegg in the next debate and all that will achieve is to make him appear more of an underdog to floating voters and allow him to re-iterate his views (which carry weight with some undecided voters in the post-expenses era) about 'old politics' (ie Conservative & Labour) vs 'the new' (ie Lib-Dem).<br /><br />This has been a terrible few days to be a Conservative. The weekend's press coverage has not made comfortable reading. However, another bad performance on Thursday and it will be even worse (and perhaps unrecoverable?)<br /><br />What a poor start we have got off to after such high hopes. Why? Was it over-confidence or simply poor strategy?Stevehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180450184344630294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-55588851709376568382010-04-18T21:56:49.568+01:002010-04-18T21:56:49.568+01:00Agree that personal attacks are both wrong and unl...Agree that personal attacks are both wrong and unlikely to win support. Sadly, I fear that CCHQ halfwits will be urging DC to undermine Clegg in the next debate and all that will achieve is to make him appear more of an underdog to floating voters and allow him to re-iterate his views (which carry weight with some undecided voters in the post-expenses era) about 'old politics' (ie Conservative & Labour) vs 'the new' (ie Lib-Dem).<br /><br />This has been a terrible few days to be a Conservative. The weekend's press coverage has not made comfortable reading. However, another bad performance on Thursday and it will be even worse (and perhaps unrecoverable?)<br /><br />What a poor start we have got off to after such high hopes. Why? Was it over-confidence or simply poor strategy?Stevehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02180450184344630294noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-19084780919616676392010-04-18T21:36:02.635+01:002010-04-18T21:36:02.635+01:00The Captain Clegg 'surge' would open up an...The Captain Clegg 'surge' would open up an opportunity. Cameron could repeat his promise of a referendum on any future transfer of powers to Brussels, exposing Clegg's breach of promise over Lisbon, and forcing a statement from Clegg on his current EU position. Just a thought.<br /><br />Cameron could couch this in terms of being confused as to what Lib Dem policy on the EU really is.<br /><br />Piece of cake.Tapestryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17267094484651413428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-30217404356479309722010-04-18T20:23:38.736+01:002010-04-18T20:23:38.736+01:00What this has done is turn polling on its head, an...What this has done is turn polling on its head, and gone is the expectation that the sampling does indeed represent voters' real intentions and that the poll ratings do in someway translate into seats. Newspapers are having a field day, just as they had during Diana mass hysteria. If by any chance the expected coalition govt of Brown and Clegg falls, the aftermath can be full of cynicism on the democratic process itself. Then plague on all their houses!<br /><br />I asked my neighbours a bunch of pretty ladies, how would their voting intentions of supporting Libdems would have changed, had Old Cable instead of young Clegg took part in the debate. They stared at me with anger and are not going to speak to me for months! My mother used to say to girls , beware of attractive youngmen's promises!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-23714482982907036722010-04-18T18:40:48.127+01:002010-04-18T18:40:48.127+01:00Hi Iain, I seem to remember warning you about Nick...Hi Iain, I seem to remember warning you about Nick Clegg once in 18 Doughty St. Thanks for the words of sanity: the public really do want a grown up debate about the future direction of the country- and this negative personal stuff is just a travesty.<br /><br />I must say I am enjoying this campaign: I shall be up in Scotland for the last week and I am hearing that the Lib Dems are doing well.<br /><br />Good Luck with things- maybe catch up again sometimeCicerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02090838836212624633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-30136214684042415772010-04-18T17:56:39.140+01:002010-04-18T17:56:39.140+01:00Amazing isn't it. Times change and the Mail is...Amazing isn't it. Times change and the Mail is as offensive as ever, and yet lacks the ability to see that it is part of an increasingly contemptible tiny group of emotive and unpleasant bigotsPaul Burginhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06718135185726733792noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-10510918591129704992010-04-18T17:12:03.534+01:002010-04-18T17:12:03.534+01:00I'm surprised, or maybe not, that you haven...I'm surprised, or maybe not, that you haven't realised that this is part of a multi pronged attack on Clegg.<br /><br />Clegg = Foreign = rampant Europhile.<br /><br />Simple for those that want to see.Houdinihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02299827686189026014noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-4957355685959013492010-04-18T16:35:23.833+01:002010-04-18T16:35:23.833+01:00Much more of this and the Hitler on Sunday may beg...Much more of this and the Hitler on Sunday may begin to acquire a reputation for intolerance.Jimmyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01542633492362670045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-62153882560098127182010-04-18T16:25:59.171+01:002010-04-18T16:25:59.171+01:00If the LibDems are really promising, or rather thr...If the LibDems are really promising, or rather threatening, an 'in/out' referendum on UK membership of the EU, with the real risk that it would result in a vote for 'out', that's surely reason enough for voting Labour.<br /><br /><b>Brian</b><br /><a href="http://www.barder.com/ephems/" rel="nofollow">http://www.barder.com/ephems/</a>BrianBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14787952058849504425noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-71550280317563441352010-04-18T15:40:18.512+01:002010-04-18T15:40:18.512+01:00Isn't there a distinction between the Lib Dem ...Isn't there a distinction between the Lib Dem style of personal attack ie lying and legitimate querying of the important personal issue of "character" for someone who seeks high office? <br /><br />Wouldn't it be entirely legitimate to query Clegg's claim to have a "minor" conviction for "arson" whilst a drunken 16 year old student in Germany? <br /><br />Or indeed given the implausibility of setting fire to a cactus, to query whether there is not a substantial degree of embellishment to the account? <br /><br />Oops, back to lying, its a circular process!Bardirecthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12167919762034389133noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-61048424313769252022010-04-18T15:22:19.231+01:002010-04-18T15:22:19.231+01:00@ Grand Inquisitor. If voters vote for a hung pa...@ Grand Inquisitor. If voters vote for a hung parliament and if Labour becomes the largest party, Brown does not have to invite Libdems to join the govt. He can form a minority govt and if Libdems want to join it, it will be under Brown's terms. Clegg knows that it will be the only chance for a life-time for him and his Libdem friends to become ministers. Clegg and every one knows that if Brown is voted down and Cameron refuses to form a govt, The ensuing GE will see the Libdem getting less seats as his novelty would have worn out and he would have seen to have failed to bring in PR. My guss is he will swallow his pride and he and Libdem buddies will meekly accept minor ministries. Deluded Libdems are blogging every where saying changee will arrive this and that. Well that is Libdems for you!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-66263802950337213192010-04-18T15:00:16.408+01:002010-04-18T15:00:16.408+01:00Lib dems should never be given power because they ...Lib dems should never be given power because they want PR which means they never lose power. That would not be good for democracy. In fact it would be so bad I believe the lib dems would vanish. <br /><br />There is so many unresolved deeply unstable legacy issues in this country. So many knots to unravel. The English Parliament, centralisation of power,immigration, power supplies, cuts of £250bn needed, unreformed civil service. <br /><br />The only revolution we have had is spin and sound bites from the nasty political pair of pygmies - Mandelson and Campbell. They have stored so many problems up in this country and have changed nothing for the positive.javelinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04685858339910528013noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-40886055558825859462010-04-18T14:44:39.185+01:002010-04-18T14:44:39.185+01:00Having just watched Brown on the Marr Programme I ...Having just watched Brown on the Marr Programme I can see that Brown still does not get it. Clegg's popularity is because a lot of people just want a change - and could not care less about Brown's policies (nor Cameron's either for that matter). The big expense-bending parties in the last Parliament are now the big liabilities in people's minds.<br /><br />Did you notice Brown's offer of PR - but for the upper chamber only? Clegg, beware Greeks bearing gifts!<br /><br />P.S. Somebody please tell Gordon that the Lib-Dem Party is not the same as the Liberal Party (which still exists)!Grand_Inquisitorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12008480897159991738noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-45446832006969037772010-04-18T14:34:36.457+01:002010-04-18T14:34:36.457+01:00Personal attacks against Nick Clegg are wrong, as ...Personal attacks against Nick Clegg are wrong, as are personal attacks against David Cameron and Gordon Brown. The party leaders should be judged on their policies, views and how they have voted since being elected to parliament.<br /><br />I don't care about the ethnicity of Nick Clegg's parents or staff. I would have thought their ethnicity was only of significance to BNP supporters.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-33875332978910094532010-04-18T14:33:13.755+01:002010-04-18T14:33:13.755+01:00Besides the fact they are infantile, they can be v...Besides the fact they are infantile, they can be very counter-productive. I am sure if this kind of scrutiny were passed over all the Tory MPs there would be some odd anomalies.Andrew Ian Dodgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16293965494182995460noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-8988894488172728572010-04-18T14:03:30.975+01:002010-04-18T14:03:30.975+01:00@Cantstandcant. Do you want to come to our consti...@Cantstandcant. Do you want to come to our constituency and listen to what Libdems say about Cameron? I thought Cavanagh article was good. Clegg was called Calamity Clegg by Huhne.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-65715664739147323642010-04-18T14:01:28.511+01:002010-04-18T14:01:28.511+01:00But is he an Abba man?But is he an Abba man?Johnny Anomalyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15990512156560686199noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-9359263974941510602010-04-18T13:56:58.848+01:002010-04-18T13:56:58.848+01:00Iain - thanks for your decent comments. The Mail a...Iain - thanks for your decent comments. The Mail article is nasty, personal and insinuating (and borderline racist). Hope it has a negative effect, and hope Tory advertisers won't plaster the country with negative anti-Clegg posters, like all the ones "quoting" smiling Gordon Brown.alexa7https://www.blogger.com/profile/01048746598425231018noreply@blogger.com