tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post3801344950899244758..comments2024-03-04T17:54:32.559+00:00Comments on Iain Dale's Diary: Clive Soley Illustrates the Lobbying ProblemIain Dalehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comBlogger41125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-5799520123179315822009-01-28T12:31:00.000+00:002009-01-28T12:31:00.000+00:00“ As I understand it, we have banned MPs from taki...<I>“ As I understand it, we have banned MPs from taking up political consultancies, and quite right too.”</I><BR/><BR/>Hmm. I note that outside income is rife - particularly on the Tory benches. <BR/><BR/>Wasn’t William Hague rather pissed off at having to give up some of his lucrative outside work when he joined the shadow cabinet? Indeed wasn’t there a mini rebellion in the shadow cabinet when Cameron started to tighten up on this? <BR/><BR/>Are shadow cabinet members now completely banned from such income - or not?Simon Gardnerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17189501697856123305noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1344162384924925822009-01-28T11:23:00.000+00:002009-01-28T11:23:00.000+00:00Ken Clarke anyone?You know, the Tories' new rising...Ken Clarke anyone?<BR/><BR/>You know, the Tories' new rising star?! lol!<BR/><BR/>Being paid by British American Tobacco. Disgraceful!<BR/><BR/>Wonder which way he voted on the smoking ban...Shamik Dashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10935999254568311462noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-44411664871069376232009-01-28T07:29:00.000+00:002009-01-28T07:29:00.000+00:00@ DespairingIf you will insist on having private c...@ Despairing<BR/><BR/>If you will insist on having private conversations with people in a public forum you can hardly be surprised if others comment. I seem to recall that Iain offers his e-mail address - why not use it if you wish matters to be private? If you sit at the dinner table don't expect privacy.<BR/><BR/>As to Iain's choice of blog - well that's his prerogative. What do you want him to do, to become impartial - just like the BBC, perhaps? It's his blog, full stop. You don't like the content? Too bad. You don't like his approach? Too bad.<BR/><BR/>As to "attacking by exception". Well, yes, you might choose to say that. <BR/><BR/>And as to Whig Gentleman - well you're wrong on both counts. I'm not a Whig - and I'm most certainly not a Gentleman.Unsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-66723401737966808992009-01-28T06:29:00.000+00:002009-01-28T06:29:00.000+00:00Thank you Ex Appy, I will, I will.I think the poin...Thank you Ex Appy, I will, I will.<BR/><BR/>I think the point is clear. Iain Dale is leading you frisky young attack dogs onto the oh-so-dreadfully corrupt Labour peers who swilled a few grand to lay down the odd ammendment. Whilst at the same time keeping the gloves off some much bigger Tory lizards who lounge in the sun, soaking up millions and fixing legislation right, left and centre for God knows what bent b***ards worldwide. All of which is apparently fine with you.<BR/><BR/>Let the casual reader decide.DespairingLiberalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02903904463236135611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-57369302579517114652009-01-27T23:23:00.000+00:002009-01-27T23:23:00.000+00:00Dear Mr DespicableLiberal, 9:16pm"Thanks for that ...Dear Mr DespicableLiberal, 9:16pm<BR/><BR/>"Thanks for that "an" "ex" "apprentice" (not sure how to pronounce your name in public)" <BR/><BR/>Same way you pronounce it in private.<BR/> <BR/>"actually quite interesting, didn't know that."<BR/><BR/>Why does that not surprise me.<BR/><BR/>"I'm sure that Tim Bell's extensive trouserings always get a fullsome airing every time he approaches a government minister with some trivial concern or other."<BR/><BR/>If you have a specific allegation to make with regard to Lord Bell, feel free to make it plainly.<BR/>If, however, you either lack the guts or the justification, and are merely playing the usual LibDumb games, go forth and multiply!an ex-apprenticehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04967821802512064291noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-27731146050644431662009-01-27T21:16:00.000+00:002009-01-27T21:16:00.000+00:00Thanks for that "an" "ex" "apprentice" (not sure h...Thanks for that "an" "ex" "apprentice" (not sure how to pronounce your name in public) - actually quite interesting, didn't know that.<BR/><BR/>I'm sure that Tim Bell's extensive trouserings always get a fullsome airing every time he approaches a government minister with some trivial concern or other.DespairingLiberalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02903904463236135611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-88061677344054638562009-01-27T21:13:00.000+00:002009-01-27T21:13:00.000+00:00Er. Unsworth. It leads me to the conclusion that i...Er. Unsworth. It leads me to the conclusion that it's not just Labour, yet Iain in time honoured tradition for this blog, simply cites Labour examples.<BR/><BR/>I am making a point in rhetoric known as "attacking by exception". It's a worthy game!<BR/><BR/>Anyway, I was rather having a private conversation with Iain, which you somewhat rudely brushed in on. Hardly the behaviour of a Whig gentleman.DespairingLiberalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02903904463236135611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-26454017509270647272009-01-27T20:46:00.000+00:002009-01-27T20:46:00.000+00:00Dear Mr DespicableLiberal, 6:08pm"Oh dear, I just ...Dear Mr DespicableLiberal, 6:08pm<BR/><BR/>"Oh dear, I just realised.<BR/><BR/>Baron Bell is a Tory and therefore not worthy of mention in this context.<BR/><BR/>Silly me."<BR/><BR/>One small matter that differentiates Lord Bell from the four Labour peers is the fact that Bell openly declares his interests in lobbying firms in section 12b of the register.<BR/><BR/>The Labour peers declare all their interests in 12d, non-parliamentary employment.<BR/><BR/>The extent to which such declarations have been made fraudulently will no doubt be of interest to the investigating authorities.an ex-apprenticehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04967821802512064291noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-30846653194643549002009-01-27T19:57:00.000+00:002009-01-27T19:57:00.000+00:00Lords are paid. Like us who work they have to pitc...Lords are paid. Like us who work they have to pitch up to get £350pd ++++++.<BR/>Unlike us they can sit and nod for this. And then get subsidised food and bev.Savonarolahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07500688050397705993noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-70632471008098566012009-01-27T19:18:00.000+00:002009-01-27T19:18:00.000+00:00@ Despairing"True Iain, but my point is that a ver...@ Despairing<BR/><BR/><I>"True Iain, but my point is that a very large number of them are at it, of all parties."</I><BR/><BR/>And that oft repeated opinion leads you to what conclusion? That this is therefore acceptable? That we should just simply accept it? <BR/><BR/><I>"It's a shame really, but the British Parliament has sadly (and really very quickly) headed the way of the fantastically bent US Congress, where most of the opinions and votes are for sale to the highest bidder."</I><BR/><BR/>That may or may not be so, and it depends on what you might mean by 'very quickly' but your point is what? After all, peerages and constituencies have been sold for centuries and so on. <BR/><BR/>The whole point is this: Legislation cannot ensure observance of laws, nor can it substitute for individual decency and honesty. But if we do not protest then this behaviour will certainly increase, so it is up to each of us to do what we can to ensure that these people are made uncomfortable and are held to account. I do not see many Labour Party supporters expressing their concern at these reports - quite the contrary. It follows that they are in favour of this kind of activity.<BR/><BR/>Or would you rather simply close the door and hope it will all go away?Unsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-83848010217629114072009-01-27T18:41:00.000+00:002009-01-27T18:41:00.000+00:00Never mind the ethical issue Iain we want to know ...Never mind the ethical issue Iain we want to know who allowed a crackpot <A HREF="http://greenteeth.blog.co.uk/2009/01/26/religious-cult-behind-latest-labour-sleaze-scandal-5451247/" REL="nofollow">religious cult </A> to infiltrate the Labour Party. The last thing we need in the corridors of power is a Moonie.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-58243414392801659142009-01-27T18:29:00.000+00:002009-01-27T18:29:00.000+00:00Re Chris Paul 3:44Hansard :Statements : Infrastruc...Re Chris Paul 3:44<BR/><BR/><BR/>Hansard :<BR/>Statements : <BR/>Infrastructure (15 Jan 2009):<BR/>Column 1384:<BR/>3:07pm<BR/><BR/>Though if he'd taken the £29k and not spoken, I would say that was worse.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06316982898658993323noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-90782721176606973912009-01-27T18:17:00.000+00:002009-01-27T18:17:00.000+00:00True Iain, but my point is that a very large numbe...True Iain, but my point is that a very large number of them are at it, of all parties.<BR/><BR/>It's a shame really, but the British Parliament has sadly (and really very quickly) headed the way of the fantastically bent US Congress, where most of the opinions and votes are for sale to the highest bidder.DespairingLiberalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02903904463236135611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-35315630250057335422009-01-27T18:13:00.000+00:002009-01-27T18:13:00.000+00:00Despairing Liberal, I don't think I have played th...Despairing Liberal, I don't think I have played the party political card with this at all. Every party has its problems in this area - even the LibDems. <BR/><BR/>I'm not saying this in his defence, merely pointing out a fact, Tim Bell owned a PR firm long before he was ennobled. But I accept that it's a legitimate issue to raise.Iain Dalehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-14153785494248807592009-01-27T18:10:00.000+00:002009-01-27T18:10:00.000+00:00John Pickworth - I am sure you are right. NuLab ar...John Pickworth - I am sure you are right. NuLab are institutionally corrupt. This is wholly different to the Tory Party. The latter is merely corrupt as an institution.DespairingLiberalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02903904463236135611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-4102613206187556852009-01-27T18:08:00.000+00:002009-01-27T18:08:00.000+00:00You're right, it's utterly appalling Iain.Even mor...You're right, it's utterly appalling Iain.<BR/><BR/>Even more extreme then is a case you should also be focusing on - I refer to none other than Timothy John Leigh Bell, Baron Bell, aka, <B>Tim Bell</B> of Bell Pottinger.<BR/><BR/>This is the noble Lord who amongst his many past lobbying achievements, I quote from his Wikipedia entry, "<I>successfully lobbied on behalf of the Saudi government to discontinue the Serious Fraud Office investigation into alleged bribes in the Al Yamamah arms deal.</I>"<BR/><BR/>In his spare time he indulges in lobbying for many a foreign dictator or bent Russian.<BR/><BR/>It is difficult to imagine a more clear-cut case to bring to your reader's attention Iain.<BR/><BR/>Oh dear, I just realised.<BR/><BR/>Baron Bell is a Tory and therefore not worthy of mention in this context.<BR/><BR/>Silly me.DespairingLiberalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02903904463236135611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-27736612139705024312009-01-27T18:07:00.000+00:002009-01-27T18:07:00.000+00:00Why this obsession on the part of Boothroyd and CP...Why this obsession on the part of Boothroyd and CP as to what Hansard reported? <BR/>Iain said "I'm listening to Lord Soley on the Simon Mayo programme explain why it's quite OK, thank you very much, for him to be paid £29,000 by the pro-Heathrow interests to argue their case on the media, and presumably in the House of Lords." <BR/>Do they seriously expect us to believe that argument/influencing is all going to be on the record?MattyThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00479577737913839952noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-12998511487124235952009-01-27T18:04:00.000+00:002009-01-27T18:04:00.000+00:00If Messrs Chris Paul and David Boothroyd seriously...If Messrs Chris Paul and David Boothroyd seriously believe that all of the business carried on in Parliament is within the Chambers and recorded in Hansard then they are deluded. <BR/><BR/>However, I do not believe that they think that. I believe that they are mere apologists for Labour Party corruption and incompetence. They are disingenuous. They may protest that they wish to see fairness and justice. But I cannot recall a single occasion when a Conservative or Lib Dem member has been found wanting where either of these two gentlemen has so readily rushed to put up a defence. Thus it's clear that they wish to continue bolstering a discredited, incompetent and dishonourable regime. <BR/><BR/>By their friends and deeds so shall you know them.Unsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08307116169498533047noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-55133015302620195462009-01-27T17:40:00.000+00:002009-01-27T17:40:00.000+00:00To those who wish to check what speeches were made...To those who wish to check what speeches were made to the Lords and what he said and other data - follow this link;http://www.theyworkforyou.com/peer/lord_soley#hansardWeygandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11359751090279735138noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-87644510450256225452009-01-27T17:39:00.000+00:002009-01-27T17:39:00.000+00:00Jonathan Cook said...You have to wonder - Is Labou...<B><BR/>Jonathan Cook said...</B><BR/><BR/><I>You have to wonder - Is Labour institutionally corrupt?</I><BR/><BR/>Why wonder? From that first day in 1997 they have pretty much run the show for their own benefit. Remember how quickly Blair stuffed his lawyer friends into prime roles? The hoards of Scots, and the friends of Scots? The rubbing shoulders with the Celebs?<BR/><BR/>Its one complete scam... The UK Government is a Firm in precisely the same way certain Chicago 'families' used to conduct business. Few in Government are there on merit (including the PM), they're there because they've got powerful friends or they've trampled upon others to get to the front of the trough of plenty.<BR/><BR/>And us? We are the easy marks, the suckers paying protection money to the Firm with no guarantee any protection will be forthcoming.John Pickworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02166443099429490782noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-82255937537838504622009-01-27T17:34:00.000+00:002009-01-27T17:34:00.000+00:00Off topic but non the lessThe record time for a he...Off topic but non the less<BR/><BR/>The record time for a headless chicken to live is 18 months - lets see if Gordon can beat the record<BR/><BR/>http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=108098694Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-76410105487000562802009-01-27T15:52:00.000+00:002009-01-27T15:52:00.000+00:00You have to wonder - Is Labour institutionally cor...You have to wonder - Is Labour institutionally corrupt?<BR/><BR/>Labour seem set up, top to bottom, to sell influence over government policy.<BR/><BR/>For instance - allegedly the following has all taken place:<BR/><BR/>1. Prime Minister - changed tobacco laws for a fee<BR/><BR/>2. Party Finances - cash for peerages<BR/><BR/>3. Lobbyists - a certain new blogger got caught selling influence of government<BR/><BR/>4. Trade Unions - have Labour over a funding barrel and extract policy change<BR/><BR/>5. House of Lords - a few peers have been caught selling amendments to laws.Trend Shedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817609330878848716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-37417340348229531632009-01-27T15:46:00.000+00:002009-01-27T15:46:00.000+00:00Time to dust off that obscure common law offense, ...Time to dust off that obscure common law offense, <B>"misconduct in a public office"</B> ?<BR/><BR/>:-)Nigelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18171835878570773595noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-77741044056672732342009-01-27T15:44:00.000+00:002009-01-27T15:44:00.000+00:00PS Hansard capture what is said in parliament and...PS Hansard capture what is said in parliament and if you search for Soley and the relevant terms you will presumably find as Mr Boothroyd has done that he ain't been speaking on these matters as Mr Dale so wrongly implies.Chris Paulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15679067503215414300noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-46652832630679759212009-01-27T15:42:00.000+00:002009-01-27T15:42:00.000+00:00Dorian Smith makes an interestign point ... then a...Dorian Smith makes an interestign point ... then again they often don't mention that Iain Dale is a Tory ...<BR/><BR/>And David Boothroyd makes an excellent point. Showing that once again Mr Dale is un unwitting scoundrel.Chris Paulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15679067503215414300noreply@blogger.com