tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post115412276721543549..comments2024-03-04T17:54:32.559+00:00Comments on Iain Dale's Diary: LibDem News Publishes Pro Terrorist LetterIain Dalehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comBlogger70125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1155078972688187912006-08-09T00:16:00.000+01:002006-08-09T00:16:00.000+01:00There is a "Friends of Israel" group within the Li...There is a "Friends of Israel" group within the Lib Dems but as yet no "Friends of Palestine". Given your comment from "C4" I have to say I am sick to death of the simplicitic notion that challenging Israeli aggression/inhumanity equates to anti-semitism what utter nonsense, that is the equivalent of branding anyone racist in this country who challenges forced marriages on the grounds that they are an affront human rights. Grow up C4 - you are part of the problem, not part of the solution.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154446024655873052006-08-01T16:27:00.000+01:002006-08-01T16:27:00.000+01:00Iain, you arw wrong and need to correct yourself. ...Iain, you arw wrong and need to correct yourself. Paul Corney was never Norman Lamb's agent. Paul's wife Pam was Norman's agent, not Paul. I hope you will correct your error as we wouldn't want you libelling Norman Lamb again.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154445659622995132006-08-01T16:20:00.000+01:002006-08-01T16:20:00.000+01:00Why I am not not surprised? Most of the Liberal De...Why I am not not surprised? Most of the Liberal Democrats I know are anti-Semites.Sir-C4'https://www.blogger.com/profile/03917709983378003032noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154365640309684582006-07-31T18:07:00.000+01:002006-07-31T18:07:00.000+01:00Tom is beyond help, peeps.Sabretache - Just becaus...Tom is beyond help, peeps.<BR/><BR/>Sabretache - Just because it is 1:04 a.m. where you are doesn't mean it's 1:04 all over the great big world.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154352663808071092006-07-31T14:31:00.000+01:002006-07-31T14:31:00.000+01:00There is a HUGE pro-Israeli lobby in the Lib Dems....There is a HUGE pro-Israeli lobby in the Lib Dems.<BR/><BR/>They were the writers of most of the hate mail that Jenny Tonge recieved after her commentsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154348606623032312006-07-31T13:23:00.000+01:002006-07-31T13:23:00.000+01:00Towcestarian, you are caught up in a circle of you...Towcestarian, you are caught up in a circle of your own making that you cannot square.<BR/><BR/>You know you cannot defend these massacres, so you have to rely on personal insults and ridiculous legal arguments and even imply that the slaughters are a fiction created by the media.<BR/><BR/>You presumably have never read the Geneva Conventions that talks about care to protect the civillian population, of providing protection to hospitals and ambulances. <BR/><BR/>As for what you call "bog-standard Daily Mail hysteria," perhaps you have not seen the images of hysteria on the news. Hysterical mothers who have lost their children in a pile of rubble, children who have lost their parents. This is not a Daily Mail hysteria. It isn't a fiction. These are real people, who you seem to imply should pay with their lives by the dozens and we should all just accept it and stop being hysterical. <BR/><BR/>You can hide behind as many excuses and red-herrings as you like, but in the end you are the one with the problem. <BR/><BR/>You are the one that has decided to defend what you know is not defendable, presumably because rather than siding with the innocent, you are immovable in taking the side of those that are killing the innocent. <BR/><BR/>TomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154319534677143182006-07-31T05:18:00.000+01:002006-07-31T05:18:00.000+01:00VerityBeing right about everything wont bring you ...Verity<BR/>Being right about everything wont bring you to much love or many friends, take my word for it, but you have my respect anyway.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154289012025880042006-07-30T20:50:00.000+01:002006-07-30T20:50:00.000+01:00Anonymous Tom 7:43You just don't get it, do you?Th...Anonymous Tom 7:43<BR/><BR/>You just don't get it, do you?<BR/><BR/>This is not about "slaughter of the innocents", it is about the rules of warfare and the Geneva Convention. "Innocents" and children dying in warfare is not necessarily "against the rules", and when it happens it is not necessarily the people killing them who are responsible.<BR/><BR/>The 50+ children who apparently died today were not "fair game" as you put it, which implies deliberate targetting. However, if they have been killed inadvertently in a proportionate attack on a legitimate military target, then this is not against the Geneva Convention. If they have been deliberately put in a building being used by the Hezzies for military purposes then their deaths ARE a war crime, but not an Israeli one. If the attack was disproportionate or the Israelis knew the place had no military significance they the guilt is with them. And if the bulding had no military significance but the Israelis had good reason to think it had, then according to the GC, no-one is to blame - its just war.<BR/><BR/>If you find these concepts difficuct/unpleasant, can I suggest you stick to the day job and don't think about a creer as a war crimes lawyer.towcestarianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15092802492560172339noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154285030194346232006-07-30T19:43:00.000+01:002006-07-30T19:43:00.000+01:00Towcestarian, you continue to defend mass slaughte...Towcestarian, you continue to defend mass slaughter of the innocent. <BR/><BR/>No doubt you think the 50+ slaughtered today were also fair game or are you going to bring in your new argument that we shouldn't believe what we see in the media. Then where are you getting your information? <BR/><BR/>Tom<BR/><BR/>You and Verity have made your position quite clear. You are condemned by your own words and you know it.<BR/><BR/>At least the majority of the people of Britain and the rest of the world, world governments and even Jack Straw appear to condemn it, even if a few extremist sympathisers of child massacres won't.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154275772863088112006-07-30T17:09:00.000+01:002006-07-30T17:09:00.000+01:00Two Points(1) On blame in the present situation:Hi...Two Points<BR/><BR/>(1) On blame in the present situation:<BR/><BR/>Hizbullah is not a government, therefore if it takes Israeli soldiers into captvity, that is, by definition, kidnapping.<BR/><BR/>More to the point, when Hizbullah launches 100+ rockets stuffed full of ball bearings with the clear and deliberate intention of killing Israeli wmen and children, that is quire simply mass murder, period.<BR/><BR/>When Israel, in order to try to prevent thse literally murderous rockets killing its people, attacks a launch site and it happens that Hizbullah has intentionally placed the site among innocent Lebanese women and children, the Israelis may kill some unintentionally, but it is Hizbullah that is guilty of murder <B>again</B> by chosing the sort of location they do when they know the Israelis will have no choice but to protect their own people by attacking that site.<BR/><BR/>Therefore Hizbullah is the guilty party when it comes to civiliam deaths on both sides of the border.<BR/><BR/><BR/>(2) In the Arab-Israeli agreement brokered by Clinton in the '90s, it was said that Israel basically offered Arafat 99% of everything he had asked for, but still he turned the deal down because only 100% would do.<BR/><BR/>Reading Fromkin's 'A Peace to End All Peace: The Fall of the Ottoman Empire and the Creation of the Modern Middle East' (ISBN: 1842120433) one learns a lot of interesting things.<BR/><BR/>Not least is Churchill's reaction after the failure to reach an agreement between the Palestinian Arabs and the Jewish settlers in Palestine at the 1921 Middle East Conference in Cairo:<BR/><BR/>"In Churchill's eyes, the members of the Arab delegation were not doing what politicians are supposed to to do: they were not aiming to reach an agreement -- any agreement. Apparently unwilling to offer even 1% in order to get 99%, they offered no incentive to the other side to make concessions."<BR/><BR/>The more things change, the more they stay the same.<BR/><BR/>I'm afraid this offers no solution to the Arab/Israeli conflict, but it does perhaps provide an explanation: the Palestinians don't do compromise; they don't know when to quit when they are ahead; they don't understand about cutting one's losses.<BR/><BR/>And of course the longer things goes on like this, the more unwilling still they will be to compromise.<BR/><BR/>A grim outlook.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154272685251201012006-07-30T16:18:00.000+01:002006-07-30T16:18:00.000+01:00Mark you are not arguing that it would be impossib...Mark you are not arguing that it would be impossible for the Saudis to take in Palestinians instead of the free market in Filipinnos merely that it would be inconvenient. Not nearly as inconvenient as the million arabs living in Israel in your figures which hasn't stopped Israel giving them rights not avaiable in arab countries. At 1 guest worker for 4 Saudis the saudi's guests must be roughly twice the available Palestinian population which puts their inconvenience in perspective & suggest she is quite right in thinking tha Palestinians are kept deliberately as refugees as a political pawn.<BR/><BR/>Rather like Hezbollah using arab children as human shields while firing missiles at Israeli children. When we reward such behaviour, or the deliberate killing of their own people to fake Serb atrocities in Bosnia, we are rewarding such behaviour & like all blackmail, assuring it will be repeated.neil craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09157898238945726349noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154269453703387462006-07-30T15:24:00.000+01:002006-07-30T15:24:00.000+01:00Anonymous Tom 12:32You are still reading high on t...Anonymous Tom 12:32<BR/><BR/>You are still reading high on the codswallop-o-meter.<BR/><BR/>Targetting of legitimate military targets is decided on a case-by-case basis, knowing what the military objective was and what can be done to minimise non-combattant casualties. Can I suggest that neither you nor I have access to any of that information and all we are working on are 3rd hand reports from people with vested interests. Have you never heard of propaganda?<BR/><BR/>For instance, that "ambulance" that was supposed to have been blown up by an Israeli missile. From the few pictures I saw, it had a couple of broken windows and a few medium-calibre bullet holes. Curiously, it had the Red Cross sign on it rather than the Red Crescent. It might well have been a real amulance that had been attacked by Israelis, then again...<BR/><BR/>Without 1st hand information information, the claim of deliberate targetting of civillians/ambulances etc is just idle speculation. I'm sure you would be the first to condemn trial by media under any other circumstances, but when it is the Israeli/American military, your type are quite happy to resort to bog-standard Daily Mail hysteria.towcestarianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15092802492560172339noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154255695117363192006-07-30T11:34:00.000+01:002006-07-30T11:34:00.000+01:00Iain,There are plenty of pro-israel Lib Dems, in t...Iain,<BR/><BR/>There are plenty of pro-israel Lib Dems, in the sense that we see why the Israel is doing what it is, but that doesn't obligate us to think it's the best idea, does it?<BR/><BR/>At the risk of cheapening what is a very serious debate (which I applaud you for raising) the fact that you give so much time to attacking the Lib Dems is great news for us, 5 years ago the two main parties would never even both giving us a mention.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154246515450564052006-07-30T09:01:00.000+01:002006-07-30T09:01:00.000+01:00Verity (presumably standing for Truth - in rather ...Verity (presumably standing for Truth - in rather the same way that Pravda stands for Truth?) <BR/><BR/>“<I>Why are they still importing Filippinas, Indonesians, Sri Lankans as maids when they have fellow Arabs who speak their language and know their ways right there on their doorstep?</I><BR/><BR/>Leaving aside that the number of foreign workers has fallen from one per 3.38 Saudis in 2002 to one per 3.84 Saudis in 2006, why are they still importing workers? It is called the Market. Useful as an Arabic speaking Palestinian maid might be, you can still buy domestic servants cheaper from Asia. They have a stronger work ethic - and the Christian ones don’t need to break off their chores five times a day to pray - and work through Ramadan too. But perhaps you are suggesting that the Palestinians should work for nothing as “guest arbeiters” - as an act of gratitude to their “fellow Arabs”?<BR/><BR/><I>I feel that they don't want the Palestinians because a) it suits their political purpose to have "victims of Israel and the West" existing in Palestine.</I><BR/><BR/>“Feel” is not good enough. <BR/><BR/><I>The Saudis, whatever their population problem, Kuwaitis, the Emirates are refusing to take in their fellow Arab Middle Easterners</I><BR/><BR/>Where is your evidence that “fellow Arabs” have physically prevented Palestinians from going to their countries? My understanding – from extensive travel in the Middle East (I was there only two weeks ago) - is that many Palestinians impose these squalid conditions upon themselves as the only pressure they believe they can apply to pursue their case to the world that they have been “evicted” from their lands. And as you say “<I>Having the Palestinians as a thorn in the side of Israel and the West for four generations has served them well</I>”<BR/><BR/><I>They should be tried for crimes against humanity. Oh, wait a minute; that's only for the West</I><BR/><BR/>In the time-honoured tradition of lobbing in a grenade with a final comment that is intended to deflect from the weaknesses of the earlier argument (you are very good at this – who trained you?) how about this – if crimes against humanity really were only for the West, then why aren’t Bush and Blair in The Hague answering to charges that they willingly and knowingly undertook an illegal war in Iraq? Truth is, charges of crimes against humanity only get brought against those who have lost power and can no longer either be a useful future ally/supplier of raw materials and/or purchaser of our goods (for which, usually read weapons).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154221275564013142006-07-30T02:01:00.000+01:002006-07-30T02:01:00.000+01:00Sorry Marquee Mark,but when they needed help, why ...Sorry Marquee Mark,but when they needed help, why didn't they take their own in first? Why are they still importing Filippinas, Indonesians, Sri Lankans as maids when they have fellow Arabs who speak their language and know their ways right there on their doorstep?<BR/><BR/>I appreciate your figures, but, with respect, I feel that they don't want the Palestinians because a) it suits their political purpose to have "victims of Israel and the West" existing in Palestine. This is cynical and repulsive, but so is war. The Wahabbis are set on winning this religious war to win the world for allah. <BR/><BR/>Having the Palestinians as a thorn in the side of Israel and the West for four generations has served them well.<BR/><BR/>About poor, civilised Jordan ... well, their fellow Arabs don't care. Nor does Kuwait. Nor do the Emirates. Rich, rich, rich ... but don't give homes and jobs to the Palestinians. Import Muslim Indonesians who don't speak Arabic; and import Filippinas and Filippinos who also don't speak your language and are Christian,<BR/><BR/>It only makes sense if you see that the Palestinians are to be presented as victims of Israeli oppression. A Madame Tussaud's of oppressed people, stuck in waxed poses with a contrived background.<BR/><BR/>The Saudis, whatever their population problem, Kuwaitis, the Emirates are refusing to take in their fellow Arab Middle Easterners in favour of Sri Lankans and Filippinas and Filippinos ... why?<BR/><BR/>Because they want that open running sore. They should be tried for crimes against humanity. Oh, wait a minute; that's only for the West.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154215945587074732006-07-30T00:32:00.000+01:002006-07-30T00:32:00.000+01:00To Towcestarian and Verity. Verity you said: "As t...To Towcestarian and Verity. <BR/><BR/>Verity you said: "As to the plaintive cry, "Oh, but they're killing innocent women and children!", no they're not." <BR/><BR/>Does that answer your question: "Where on earth did I claim that the children are not innocent?"<BR/><BR/>Unfortunately both of your arguments, cold-hearted as it is, holds no water. <BR/><BR/>Are we supposed to believe that hospitals, UN workers, ambulance convoys, houses with families inside, cars filled with fleeing Lebanese and office blocks are all legitimate targets, just in case Hezbollah are there and that the child fatalities, now in the hundreds are to be defended? <BR/><BR/>If we are to call these military targets, then everywhere and everyone by that definition is fair game to be bombed. <BR/><BR/>Call me old fashioned, but when you kill hundreds of children INDESCRIMINATELY, you become no better than the terrorists you claim you are attacking and all you do is increase the hatred and the resolve of those that want to destroy you.<BR/><BR/>Through absense to condemn those doing the killing on both sides, you argue FOR the terror that you claim you are against. <BR/><BR/>The difference is that because the terror I am specifically talking about is being inflicted on the innocent people of Lebanon and not Israel or UK or USA, that appears to make it alright. <BR/><BR/>You have both totally condradicted yourselves by defending the indefendable. <BR/><BR/>TomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154214770878106892006-07-30T00:12:00.000+01:002006-07-30T00:12:00.000+01:00The idea put forward by Verity that Saudi could (s...The idea put forward by Verity that Saudi could (should?) have absorbed the Palestinian population may have had some validity twenty or thirty years ago. However, it is not an option today. A huge concern pointed out to me when I was there is that the Saudi population profile has one of the highest growth rates in the world. The population is set to double every generation. The infrastructure in Riyadh, Jeddah - indeed all the other major population centres - are bursting at the seams. They require huge capital spends on their roads, sewage, water, housing and power infrastructure. And there are insufficient jobs for the masses coming up through the schools. The worry for the current regime is that they may prove to be a catalyst for unrest - and perhaps violent regime change. Al Qaeda hopes so…<BR/><BR/>The figures below (estimates admittedly, but the best I can finds for now) show that in the last four years the population of non-nationals has risen by 200,000 (part of which may be children of exisiting non-nationals rather than new adult workers). In the same four year period, there are 3.3 million new Saudi nationals. <BR/><BR/>Saudi Arabia - Population 2002<BR/><BR/>23,513,330 <BR/>note: includes 5,360,526 non-nationals (July 2002 est.)<BR/><BR/>http://www.did-you-mean.com/travel/Saudi_Arabia<BR/><BR/><BR/>Saudi Arabia - Population 2006<BR/>27,019,731 <BR/>note: includes 5,576,076 non-nationals (July 2006 est.)<BR/>Age structure<BR/>0-14 years: 38.2% (male 5,261,530/female 5,059,041) <BR/>15-64 years: 59.4% (male 9,159,519/female 6,895,616) <BR/>65 years and over: 2.4% (male 342,020/female 302,005) (2006 est.)<BR/><BR/>http://www.indexmundi.com/saudi_arabia/demographics_profile.html<BR/><BR/><BR/>Saudi has arguably already done its bit in taking in Palestinians:<BR/><BR/>Palestinian Population Worldwide<BR/>(mid-2001)<BR/><BR/>West Bank & Gaza Strip 3,298,951<BR/>Israel 1,012,741<BR/>Jordan 2,472,501<BR/>Lebanon 456,824<BR/>Syria 494,501<BR/>Egypt 51,805<BR/>Saudi Arabia 291,778<BR/>Kuwait & other Gulf 149,786<BR/>Libya and Iraq 78,884<BR/>Other Arab countries 5,887<BR/>The Americas 216,196<BR/>Other Countries 275,303<BR/><BR/>Total 8,807,518<BR/><BR/> http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/arabs/palpoptotal.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154209500851267092006-07-29T22:45:00.000+01:002006-07-29T22:45:00.000+01:00"Are there any LibDems that are pro-Israel?"Strang..."Are there any LibDems that are pro-Israel?"<BR/><BR/>Strangely enough, yes. The "Friends of Isreal" fringe meeting is always very well attended at the LibDem conference. The imbibement of Israeli wines usually ends up with attendees stumbling blinkingly into the afternoon light at about 4pm.<BR/><BR/>The same page in the LibDem news includes two pro-Isreali letters and 2 relatively balanced letters.Paul Walterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00525444717679391831noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154195231668756862006-07-29T18:47:00.000+01:002006-07-29T18:47:00.000+01:00...and anonymous Tom 4:17More complete twaddle.Ver......and anonymous Tom 4:17<BR/><BR/>More complete twaddle.<BR/><BR/>Verity in a cold-hearted way was saying something completely sensible. The Hezzies are using the civilian population as cover for their military activities. In terms of the Geneva Convention, this is a war crime, and Israel are quite within their rights to attack legitimate military targets within civillian communities even if it means that non-combattants are killed. In these circumstances, the deaths of the "innocents" is entirely the responsibility of the side being attacked, not the attackers.<BR/><BR/>Can I suggest you spend more time reading the actual GC and less time on the Lib Dem Little Red Book of Obvious Israeli War Crimes.<BR/><BR/>For the less rabidly biased among you, the following article is an interesting analysis of accusations of Israeli War Crimes.<BR/><BR/>http://www.zionism-israel.com/log/archives/00000170.html<BR/><BR/>Given the source, it can't be said to be entirely unbiased, but is still a worthwhile read - in particular the bits about "proportionality".towcestarianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15092802492560172339noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154192391724158382006-07-29T17:59:00.000+01:002006-07-29T17:59:00.000+01:00The least they could do now is evacuate those neig...<I>The least they could do now is evacuate those neighbourhoods, but no. Not a chance.</I><BR/><BR/>Ah yes Verity; this evacuation will take place along the (bombed) roads, across the (destroyed) bridges, via the (disabled) airport and the (blockaded) sea ports. All safely under the watchful eye of the Israeli air force, who will keep the civilians safe by carefully bombing any approaching terrorists.<BR/><BR/><I>Now</I> I understand.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154190136863552322006-07-29T17:22:00.000+01:002006-07-29T17:22:00.000+01:00Aonymous 4:32 pm - Yes. The Palestinians are very...Aonymous 4:32 pm - Yes. The Palestinians are very independent thinkers and I can see that this independence of spirit might upset the Wahabbis.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154189669296603272006-07-29T17:14:00.000+01:002006-07-29T17:14:00.000+01:00I am sure everyone will rejoice that I have no man...I am sure everyone will rejoice that I have no managed to subscribe to LibDem News courtesy of the link posted above.Iain Dalehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03270146219458384372noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154189575112777462006-07-29T17:12:00.000+01:002006-07-29T17:12:00.000+01:00I’m utterly sick of hearing this “all Lib Dems are...I’m utterly sick of hearing this “all Lib Dems are pro-Hezbollah” wank from Tories. It’s total and unmitigated bollocks and its certainly no more true of us than it of you. Cheap, smearing trash. Plenty of Lib Dems (myself included) are of Jewish descent, and defend to the ends of the earth Israel’s right to protect us. <BR/><BR/>Since a Tory Councillor in Barnet recently opined that “Jews run everything in Britain and practically run America” I’ll take it that all Conservatives are anti-semites.Paul Evanshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03941688096751778537noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154188614054765802006-07-29T16:56:00.000+01:002006-07-29T16:56:00.000+01:00Anonymous, also mysteriously signing himself 'Tom'...Anonymous, also mysteriously signing himself 'Tom', as does The Injured Cyclist:<BR/><BR/>1. I retract my apology on another thread back.<BR/><BR/>2. "So that makes it alright to kill children? You defend the slaughter of innocent children, and claim the children are not innocent."<BR/><BR/>Where on earth did I claim that the children are not innocent? I said it is the Hezbullah who are killing women and children by situating their rockets, ammunition and men within ordinary Lebanese neighbourhoods. The Israelis have to bomb where the weapons are. It's terrible, but the future of Israel is at stake. The Lebanese should have swept this garbage out of their country, but they were too cowardly to do so. The least they could do now is evacuate those neighbourhoods, but no. Not a chance.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6214838.post-1154188150844128692006-07-29T16:49:00.000+01:002006-07-29T16:49:00.000+01:00chrisco - Could you tell us what your first langua...chrisco - Could you tell us what your first language is, as maybe someone in the commentariat of this parish speaks it and could translate for you.<BR/><BR/>You write: "The Palestinians live in poverty and squalor because they want to? Hmmm. You really are too ridiculous for words."<BR/><BR/>My entire post was a plea for the unimaginably rich Arab countries to help their brother and sister Arabs out of the squalor of the refugee camps by taking them in and giving them work passes and permission to stay. <BR/><BR/>I don't mind your having the opinion that I am "ridiculous" as long as your opinion was formed from what I wrote, and not what you misunderstood from skimming it.<BR/><BR/>You are tragically ill-informed about the situation of the Palestinians.<BR/><BR/>Israel is right in what she is doing, and the notion of negotiating a "cease fire" between a bunch of murderous, aggressive thugs and a legitimately elected government is obscene. But then, with Blair, old habits die hard.<BR/><BR/>Where are Clinton and Jimmuh in all this? Lurking in the wings, to be sure.<BR/><BR/>Chrisco - inform yourself about the Palestinians.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com